Mike Reed Drops Bomb on Metal Plates

[_MrStakhanovite]

Sounds like a game changer.

/thread

Cinepro won.

[_Buffalo]

So is everyone telling me that Gee is an angry Mormon? i thought Mormons were always perfect. How naïve of me...just playin'.

Seriously, of all the things to try to defend, the Book of Abraham would have to be the hardest. I'd be grumpy too.

Imagine trying to defend the Book of Mormon if we had the plates around to compare it to.

[_Blixa]

Much thanks to the narrator, Chris and Kishkumen for reports and updates. Mike and Chris's papers sound very interesting and I hope they are available online (I think I read this noted somewhere?). Can we hope that the Q & A were recorded as well? If not, is there a way I can get a copy of the papers?

If'n people will read the work of Nibley and the Nibley.5 generation of mopologists, as well as take time to learn about the long history of various people's interactions with them (on and off the internet), I think they will be hard pressed to ignore the mean-spirited rhetoric and character-assassination diversions that mar such work.

The good news is, of course, that there seems to be a new day dawning. A new generation of Mormon and nonmormon scholars, whose work may have apologetic uses, or may not, seems to be emerging. And this is not just good news for believers, but for everyone with an interest in American history and religious studies.

Cinepro is right. This does indeed look like an actual game changer.

[_KimberlyAnn]

Can we expect a smear piece to appear in a future issue of the Review? Time will tell, I suppose.

Oh, I hope ldsfaqs is charged with the task of writing it! He has, after all, worked side by side with apologist's fore years and nos they're believes. He'll show those fancy antimormon's like Mike Reed what's what.

KA

PS. Congrats to the presenters! I look forward to finding the papers online.

[_Blixa]

Can we expect a smear piece to appear in a future issue of the Review? Time will tell, I suppose.

Oh, I hope ldsfaqs is charged with the task of writing it! He has, after all, worked side by side with apologist's fore years and nos they're believes. He'll show those fancy antimormon's like Mike Reed what's what.

KA

PS. Congrats to the presenters! I look forward to finding the papers online.

Awesome sauce, KA.

[_Morley]

....
The good news is, of course, that there seems to be a new day dawning. A new generation of Mormon and nonmormon scholars, whose work may have apologetic uses, or may not, seems to be emerging. And this is not just good news for believers, but for everyone with an interest in American history and religious studies.

Cinepro is right. This does indeed look like an actual game changer.

Gawd, I hope this is true.

[_Blixa]

....
The good news is, of course, that there seems to be a new day dawning. A new generation of Mormon and nonmormon scholars, whose work may have apologetic uses, or may not, seems to be emerging. And this is not just good news for believers, but for everyone with an interest in American history and religious studies.

Cinepro is right. This does indeed look like an actual game changer.

Gawd, I hope this is true.

Me too. I've got my fingers crossed and it's the closest I've come to praying in years : ) The downside is that a lot of this work is distracting me from my own!

The following from Midsummer Night's Dream seems appropriate to quote here, though perhaps for purely personal and esoteric reasons:

Lysander:
Ay me! for aught that I could ever read,
Could ever hear by tale or history,
The course of true love never did run smooth;
But either it was different in blood—

Hermia:
O cross! too high to be enthrall'd to low.

Lysander:
Or else misgraffèd in respect of years—

Hermia:
O spite! too old to be engag'd to young.

Lysander:
Or else it stood upon the choice of friends—

Hermia:
O hell! to choose love by another's eyes.

I'm mostly thinking of an intellectual or scholarly love, by the way...

[_karl61]

Having a presentation that was less than faith promoting gives a little evidence that maybe the LDS church is now walking it's talk regarding allowing history to be presented - warts and all. This could be the influence of Bushman who has decided to grab Arlington's stick and run.

[_stemelbow]

Having a presentation that was less than faith promoting gives a little evidence that maybe the LDS church is now walking it's talk regarding allowing history to be presented - warts and all. This could be the influence of Bushman who has decided to grab Arlington's stick and run.

Wahoo for Bushman, stemelbow et al for leading the charge of bringing the church out of the dark ages.

We could definitely use some enlightening and opening up (hey I'm serious here. don't come down on me again).

[_Kishkumen]

Now we can at least be sure that the idea that ancient text written on metal plates is an absurdity is itself an absurdity, since not only do we know now that it was a practice in various parts of this world, but they also knew it in Joseph Smith' time.

stem,

People have long known that there were ancient records inscribed on metal plates. That part is nothing new. What is new is that, contrary to past apologetic arguments, people in Joseph Smith's day were also well aware of the existence of ancient writings on metal plates. That is not exactly a vindication of the traditional apologetic position.

K