Has COJCOLDS lost sight of the 1st principle of the gospel?

[_sock puppet]

It is necessary for us to have an understanding of God himself in the beginning.
* * * * *
If men do not comprehend the character of God, they do not comprehend themselves.
* * * * *
The scriptures inform us that "This is life eternal that they might know thee, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom thou hast sent."
* * * * *
My first object is to find out the character of the only wise and true, God, and what kind of a being He is; and if I am so fortunate as to be the man to comprehend God, and explain or convey the principles to your hearts, so that the Spirit seals them upon you, then let every man and woman henceforth sit in silence, put their hands on their mouths, and never lift their hands or voices, or say anything against the man of God or the servants of God again. But if I fail to do it, it becomes my duty to renounce all further pretensions to revelations and inspirations, or to be a prophet; and I should be like the rest of the world—a false teacher, ...
* * * * *
God himself was once as we are now, and is an exalted man, and sits enthroned in yonder heavens! That is the great secret. If the veil were rent today, and the great God who holds this world in its orbit, and who upholds all worlds and all things by His power, was to make himself visible,—I say, if you were to see him today, you would see him like a man in form like yourselves in all the person, image, and very form as a man; for Adam was created in the very fashion, image and likeness of God, and received instruction from, and walked, talked and conversed with Him, as one man talks and communes with another.
* * * * *
It is the first principle of the gospel to know for a certainty the character of God, and to know that we may converse with Him as one man converses with another, and that He was once a man like us; yea, that God himself, the Father of us all, dwelt on an earth, the same as Jesus Christ Himself did; ...
* * * * *
Here, then, is eternal life—to know the only wise and true God;... .

153 years later, the successor to JSJr's prophetdom said this--

Larry King: Just another related question that comes up is the statements in the King Follet discourse by the Prophet.
GBH: Yeah.
Larry King: ...about that, God the Father was once a man as we were. This is something that Christian writers are always addressing. Is this the teaching of the church today, that God the Father was once a man like we are?
GBH: I don't know that we teach it. I don't know that we emphasize it. I haven't heard it discussed for a long time in public discourse. I don't know. I don't know all the circumstances under which that statement was made. I understand the philosophical background behind it. But I don't know a lot about it and I don't know that others know a lot about it.

If we take GBH at face value, why has COJCOLDS strayed so far from what JSJr, at his last general conference of the Mormon Church he founded, so adamantly and declaratively specified as the first principle of the gospel? Is it no longer necessary to understand the true nature of god? Is knowing god no longer eternal life?

[_moksha]

I am pretty sure Jesus' prime message was that of love. It would make sense that love was the first principle of a restored gospel.

What President Hinckley was referring to is that we really don't know what has only been speculated about as to the nature of God, especially when that speculation was around the time of excess energy and racing thoughts. (The last bit is probably only a self projection. Afterall, I never became High Priest and King of the Earth.).

If the Pope were caged on the Larry King show and asked to explain how an angel looking like a four sided totem pole could exist, I would hope in all candor he could say "we really don't know much about this".

[_Nightlion]

It is necessary for us to have an understanding of God himself in the beginning.
* * * * *
If men do not comprehend the character of God, they do not comprehend themselves.
* * * * *
The scriptures inform us that "This is life eternal that they might know thee, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom thou hast sent."
* * * * *
My first object is to find out the character of the only wise and true, God, and what kind of a being He is; and if I am so fortunate as to be the man to comprehend God, and explain or convey the principles to your hearts, so that the Spirit seals them upon you, then let every man and woman henceforth sit in silence, put their hands on their mouths, and never lift their hands or voices, or say anything against the man of God or the servants of God again. But if I fail to do it, it becomes my duty to renounce all further pretensions to revelations and inspirations, or to be a prophet; and I should be like the rest of the world—a false teacher, ...
* * * * *
God himself was once as we are now, and is an exalted man, and sits enthroned in yonder heavens! That is the great secret. If the veil were rent today, and the great God who holds this world in its orbit, and who upholds all worlds and all things by His power, was to make himself visible,—I say, if you were to see him today, you would see him like a man in form like yourselves in all the person, image, and very form as a man; for Adam was created in the very fashion, image and likeness of God, and received instruction from, and walked, talked and conversed with Him, as one man talks and communes with another.
* * * * *
It is the first principle of the gospel to know for a certainty the character of God, and to know that we may converse with Him as one man converses with another, and that He was once a man like us; yea, that God himself, the Father of us all, dwelt on an earth, the same as Jesus Christ Himself did; ...
* * * * *
Here, then, is eternal life—to know the only wise and true God;... .

153 years later, the successor to JSJr's prophetdom said this--

Larry King: Just another related question that comes up is the statements in the King Follet discourse by the Prophet.
GBH: Yeah.
Larry King: ...about that, God the Father was once a man as we were. This is something that Christian writers are always addressing. Is this the teaching of the church today, that God the Father was once a man like we are?
GBH: I don't know that we teach it. I don't know that we emphasize it. I haven't heard it discussed for a long time in public discourse. I don't know. I don't know all the circumstances under which that statement was made. I understand the philosophical background behind it. But I don't know a lot about it and I don't know that others know a lot about it.

If we take GBH at face value, why has COJCOLDS strayed so far from what JSJr, at his last general conference of the Mormon Church he founded, so adamantly and declaratively specified as the first principle of the gospel? Is it no longer necessary to understand the true nature of god? Is knowing god no longer eternal life?

Damn straight. If you had prepped Larry King so that he formulated his follow up question better I bet the world would have witness a Hinckley melt down.
Gordon B was the consummate hypocrite. He once sent my dad home from working on a church building project for swearing. He was a born sycophant. His uncle was an apostle. An obvious traitor of not only Joseph but of Jesus Christ. Man, I hate him. He was over my home stake and told everyone not to believe the son of a swearer and they believed me not. What a shame.

[_truth dancer]

Simple... the KFD is not official doctrine.

Next?

;-)

~td~

[_jon]

Simple... the KFD is not official doctrine.

Next?

;-)

~td~

Except...that bit about God being one of us once and we can be Gods is still a current teaching within the manual entitled 'Gospel Principles'.

;^}

[_sock puppet]

Simple... the KFD is not official doctrine.

Next?

;-)

~td~

JSJr, the restoration prophet, delivered at his last general conference before he was murdered, and it can be dismissed that easily?

[_sock puppet]

I am pretty sure Jesus' prime message was that of love. It would make sense that love was the first principle of a restored gospel.

What President Hinckley was referring to is that we really don't know what has only been speculated about as to the nature of God, especially when that speculation was around the time of excess energy and racing thoughts. (The last bit is probably only a self projection. Afterall, I never became High Priest and King of the Earth.).

If the Pope were caged on the Larry King show and asked to explain how an angel looking like a four sided totem pole could exist, I would hope in all candor he could say "we really don't know much about this".

So JSJr was wrong when he pronounced, from the Mormon general conference pulpit in April 1844, that this was the 1st principle of the gospel?

And JSJr was just speculating about this 1st principle of the gospel?

So what value is anything JSJr said or claimed? And if that domino falls, don't the rest of Mormonism fall too?

[_Some Schmo]

JSJr, the restoration prophet, delivered at his last general conference before he was murdered, and it can be dismissed that easily?

It's way easier to throw a dead guy under a bus than a live guy kicking and screaming.

From the Book of Schmo, chap 19, vs 12:
"And Jesus said unto them, live in the moment and forget the wisdom of the past, even if it be mine, for it doth not benefit my church and its coffers if my disciples dwell on contradictions..."

[_truth dancer]

Simple... the KFD is not official doctrine.

Next?

;-)

~td~

JSJr, the restoration prophet, delivered at his last general conference before he was murdered, and it can be dismissed that easily?

If you had the HG, you would know that Joseph Smith was speaking as a man NOT as a prophet. He was sharing his opinion. The LDS church is a church of continuing revelation; further light and knowledge. Let go of what was in the past and focus on what was shared in GC.

In terms of this teaching in current manuals, well, um, let's see. Oh yes, GBH may not know much about this particular teaching because he hasn't given it much thought. It is not important to his salvation and exaltation. If and when God wants more information on this particular topic, then God will share it with TSM, until then, why not focus on the more important issues?

Or, you could go with.... Joseph Smith was only sharing a very small percentage of what he knew. God did not want him to share specifics so he just gave a little hint as to what is God and what humans will become. God will not reveal more information until the saints are obeying current commandments.

There you go! ;-)

~td~

[_bcspace]

Has COJCOLDS lost sight of the 1st principle of the gospel?

Doesn't appear to be the case.