ScienceWhopper:Natural History According to Jeffrey Holland

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_DrW
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Re: ScienceWhopper:Natural History According to Jeffrey Holland

Post by _DrW »

SteelHead wrote:Let's try another one.

In order to flood the Earth to a depth of 30K feet or so (depth needed to cover Mt. Everest) you would need 4.5 billion cubic kilometers of water. Total combined volume for the worlds oceans 1.3 billion cubic kilometers.

Where did the extra water come from and where did it go?

That's not the half of it. As Tarski and I agreed in an earlier thread, for the Earth's atmosphere to hold enough water vapor so as to cover most of the Earth with water as it rained out, the temperature at the surface of the Earth would have to be well above the boiling point of water before the rain started. That is, Noah and all of the humans and animals on Earth would have boiled or burned before they would have drowned, Noah and his crew with them.

If you want an example of what the conditions would be like before a rain that "covered the whole Earth", just look at the planet Venus.

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According to the geological record, there probably was a time when the "entire" Earth was covered with water. This "Snowball Earth" period appears to have been about 650 million years ago, a bit before Noah's time.

The water that covered the Earth at this time would have been a relatively thin coating of ice and snow over most of land masses except for areas where the surface winds would have swept it away leaving bare rock and soil. Near the equator, there may have been seasonal clearing of the ice and snow.

The Earth's journey from a "snowball" back to a more temperate climate appears to be a fascinating story.
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_Franktalk
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Re: ScienceWhopper:Natural History According to Jeffrey Holland

Post by _Franktalk »

SteelHead wrote:Let's try another one.

In order to flood the Earth to a depth of 30K feet or so (depth needed to cover Mt. Everest) you would need 4.5 billion cubic kilometers of water. Total combined volume for the worlds oceans 1.3 billion cubic kilometers.

Where did the extra water come from and where did it go?


Why are you so simple minded? That question is loaded with a single process which makes no sense. If the continents sank and the sea floor rose all land could be flooded. It is that simple.
_SteelHead
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Re: ScienceWhopper:Natural History According to Jeffrey Holland

Post by _SteelHead »

Franktalk wrote:
SteelHead wrote:Let's try another one.

In order to flood the Earth to a depth of 30K feet or so (depth needed to cover Mt. Everest) you would need 4.5 billion cubic kilometers of water. Total combined volume for the worlds oceans 1.3 billion cubic kilometers.

Where did the extra water come from and where did it go?


Why are you so simple minded? That question is loaded with a single process which makes no sense. If the continents sank and the sea floor rose all land could be flooded. It is that simple.


Whoa, whoa, whoa. Where does the Bible say that the mountains sank and the sea floor rose? I am pretty sure it mentions something about rain (the heavens were opened) and ground water (fountain of the great deep).

You are now inventing a new narrative to support your argument that does not agree with your literal view of the Bible.

And that type of cataclysmic plate tectonics, 30K foot mountains disappearing and reappearing in a year, would introduce a whole other set of physic problems......... the energies associated and the impacts of such re-arranging the face of the Earth would make the catastrophic ecological impact of a global flood seem like child's play.
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Re: ScienceWhopper:Natural History According to Jeffrey Holland

Post by _SteelHead »

And best of all, ignoring all the other issues with the physics of the flood.......... Not only did God magically make room in the ark, change the nature of all the beasties so they line up orderly and enter the boat, change the digestive tracks of the carnivores so that they can eat things other than the other residents of the boat, change the reproductive cycle and nature of things like mayflies, produce a globally inundating volume of water and make it disappear again........ he then after the fact rearranged things so that there is no evidence of said flood. That the ice sheets on the polar caps show no record of it. That there are other uninterrupted civilizations that existed right through it, that there are areas of demonstrated human occupation without that kind of break.

No, not only did he magic up all of the conditions necessary for the flood and the recovery from said flood, he then obliterated all of the evidence of said flood and planted false evidence contrary to it. So that we might have FAITH.

The Glory of God is Intelligence. Now turn off your rational and BELIEVE.
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_Hoops
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Re: ScienceWhopper:Natural History According to Jeffrey Holland

Post by _Hoops »

SteelHead wrote:And best of all, ignoring all the other issues with the physics of the flood.......... Not only did God magically make room in the ark, change the nature of all the beasties so they line up orderly and enter the boat, change the digestive tracks of the carnivores so that they can eat things other than the other residents of the boat, change the reproductive cycle and nature of things like mayflies, produce a globally inundating volume of water and make it disappear again........ he then after the fact rearranged things so that there is no evidence of said flood. That the ice sheets on the polar caps show no record of it. That there are other uninterrupted civilizations that existed right through it, that there are areas of demonstrated human occupation without that kind of break.

No, not only did he magic up all of the conditions necessary for the flood and the recovery from said flood, he then obliterated all of the evidence of said flood and planted false evidence contrary to it. So that we might have FAITH.

The Glory of God is Intelligence. Now turn off your rational and BELIEVE.

Once again, we have someone jumping in to criticize the Biblical record who doesn't even know the Biblical record. Study up first.
_SteelHead
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Re: ScienceWhopper:Natural History According to Jeffrey Holland

Post by _SteelHead »

Once again, we have someone jumping in to criticize the Biblical record who doesn't even know the Biblical record. Study up first.


Oh Iv'e studied it quite well.

Ok Hoops how did all the animals get into the boat and what did they eat? What are the logistics?
Last edited by Guest on Sun Oct 16, 2011 3:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
It is better to be a warrior in a garden, than a gardener at war.

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_Hoops
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Re: ScienceWhopper:Natural History According to Jeffrey Holland

Post by _Hoops »


Oh Iv'e studied it quite well.

Ok Hoops how did all the animals get into the boat and what did they eat? What are the logistics?

Why should I do all your work for you? Open a book.
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Re: ScienceWhopper:Natural History According to Jeffrey Holland

Post by _SteelHead »

Hoops wrote:

Oh Iv'e studied it quite well.

Ok Hoops how did all the animals get into the boat and what did they eat? What are the logistics?

Why should I do all your work for you? Open a book.


Which book? The Bible only says he took 7 of the clean beast and 2 of the unclean. Doesn't mention how they arrived at Noah's local from 1000s of miles away. Is that your point? That I am making suppositions?

Ok by most accounts Noah was on the Ark for 360-370 days. Sticking with just the major African cat species you had at least: lions, cheetahs, leopards, caracals and servals. What did they eat? As soon as they eat a member of one of the other species, it went extinct. Did they become vegetarians? For how long after the flood did they remain vegetarians allowing the herbivores to repopulate? Oh and since their digestive tracts won't let them be vegetarians, magic was involved. Or are you saying that because the Bible does not mention any of these scenarios that they just didn't eat? Am I supposed to just turn of my mind to the hows and believe the scant Biblical narrative?

Ok backing away from the minutia and looking at the big picture. By the biblical account 99.9999999% of all terrestrial life died in the flood. Where is the detritus?

I get it................ since the Bible says it occurred, it did. End of sentence, no more thought necessary. You don't need any details. Once the prophet has spoken the thinking is done. So you have surrendered your capacity to think.
It is better to be a warrior in a garden, than a gardener at war.

Some of us, on the other hand, actually prefer a religion that includes some type of correlation with reality.
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_Themis
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Re: ScienceWhopper:Natural History According to Jeffrey Holland

Post by _Themis »

SteelHead wrote:
Oh Iv'e studied it quite well.

Ok Hoops how did all the animals get into the boat and what did they eat? What are the logistics?


He won't give you specifics. I noticed he dodges this quite a bit and just says you are ignorant of what the Bible actually says, but won't back up what that is. I just ignore those who won't engage in honest dialog.
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_Themis
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Re: ScienceWhopper:Natural History According to Jeffrey Holland

Post by _Themis »

Franktalk wrote:
Why are you so simple minded? That question is loaded with a single process which makes no sense. If the continents sank and the sea floor rose all land could be flooded. It is that simple.


This statement shows who really is the simple minded. You just make things up without thinking about all the processes you would need to have this happen. It is not a surprise coming from those who believe in a literal global flood. I gave this up as a teenager due to actually thinking about all the evidence against such an event.
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