Its been fun today

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_Doctor Scratch
_Emeritus
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Re: Its been fun today

Post by _Doctor Scratch »

stemelbow wrote:
Doctor Scratch wrote: At what vocation are you "employed"?


That's funny Scratch. You could have sworn many things that you speculate on and then somehow later down the road that speculation becomes some proven established fact in your mind. I really thought you were going to put this silly behavior behind you.


I asked you a question, stemelbow. Why are you ignoring it?

stemelbow wrote:I haven't made up my mind one way or another on the matter of whether or not you have anything that's worth "hearing or chatting about." I've heard you repeatedly assert that you do, and that others must listen to you, but I'd like to see some more elaboration on all of this from you. If you have no reply---well, I guess that's a kind of answer in and of itself.

I assume that you think you've "got a lot to offer." Well, why not share what that might be?


I don't think I have a lot to offer. I'm not sure where you get your perceptions.


Your behavior on this board belies your statement. You clearly think that you have "a lot to offer" in terms of lecturing others about what you perceive to be "whining" or criticism of "your" LDS Church. Why do you believe it's your duty to do this?
"[I]f, while hoping that everybody else will be honest and so forth, I can personally prosper through unethical and immoral acts without being detected and without risk, why should I not?." --Daniel Peterson, 6/4/14
_Ceeboo
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Re: Its been fun today

Post by _Ceeboo »

Darth J wrote:"Orange apoplexy determinism jungle gym octopus shoelaces quantum blacksmith."




The Beatles? ("I want to hold your hand")

Peace,
Ceeboo
_stemelbow
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Re: Its been fun today

Post by _stemelbow »

Doctor Scratch wrote:I asked you a question, stemelbow. Why are you ignoring it?


I'd prefer to remain anonymous. I'm in mid-management.

Your behavior on this board belies your statement. You clearly think that you have "a lot to offer" in terms of lecturing others about what you perceive to be "whining" or criticism of "your" LDS Church. Why do you believe it's your duty to do this?


I've answered this a number of times, scratch. I point out the poor attitude, the terrible atmosphere often supported here because I think we can all do better. I have an optimistic approach. If I can get the main participators here to see the problem, accept that its a problem, and feel a desire to change we'd have a far more open, and productive board to participate in.
Love ya tons,
Stem


I ain't nuttin'. don't get all worked up on account of me.
_jon
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Re: Its been fun today

Post by _jon »

stemelbow wrote:I've answered this a number of times, scratch. I point out the poor attitude, the terrible atmosphere often supported here because I think we can all do better. I have an optimistic approach. If I can get the main participators here to see the problem, accept that its a problem, and feel a desire to change we'd have a far more open, and productive board to participate in.


Who asked you to do that or are you just assuming that you speak on behalf of others, or just speaking for yourself?

Personally I think this is one of the best boards that exists for open, frank and humorous discussion of Mormonism. It allows people to discuss the things they want to, the way they want to, with whoever they want to.

If you want to police it why not apply for modship?
'Church pictures are not always accurate' (The Nehor May 4th 2011)

Morality is doing what is right, regardless of what you are told.
Religion is doing what you are told, regardless of what is right.
_stemelbow
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Re: Its been fun today

Post by _stemelbow »

jon wrote:Who asked you to do that or are you just assuming that you speak on behalf of others, or just speaking for yourself?


For myself of course. I see potential here. In hopes to see that potential reached I'm doing my work. If it never is reached, then so be it. I can't say I haven't found benefit from participating here anyway.

Personally I think this is one of the best boards that exists for open, frank and humorous discussion of Mormonism. It allows people to discuss the things they want to, the way they want to, with whoever they want to.


For posters with a negative bent on Mormonism, you're probably right, or from your perspective you are right. But, I think frank and open and humor all can be improved around here. If you don't want to see improvement then cool. What can I do but offer my best effort to get people to see the problem. If they choose not to, no skin off my nose. I learned something anyway.

If you want to police it why not apply for modship?


I have no interest to moderate here. The rules are in place and I'm cool with them. I'm more interested in changing the general tone and atmosphere. A hostile environment, if you ask me, isn't as open as the instigators like to pretend.
Love ya tons,
Stem


I ain't nuttin'. don't get all worked up on account of me.
_jon
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Re: Its been fun today

Post by _jon »

stemelbow wrote:I have no interest to moderate here. The rules are in place and I'm cool with them. I'm more interested in changing the general tone and atmosphere. A hostile environment, if you ask me, isn't as open as the instigators like to pretend.


Again why?
If you want softball questions and faith promoting answers and a place where hostility is dealt with by an iron fist then we all know the online location where that can be had.

The rules here allow for assertive and aggressive questioning and debate. They allow for people being called out when they mislead, fudge or generally offer garbage in the place where facts should be.
People are allowed to express themselves and are allowed to be challenged. You are allowed to challenge people on wether or not they are whining.

I don't see an environment that is hostile to participants.
I see an environment that Mormonism may find hostile to the veracity of it's claims because facts can be openly expressed and debated without fear of censure.

I suppose it's all about perception and people seeing what they want to see. You see hostility where I see people being open and candid.
You seem to want to 'cure' the board from things that you personally don't like, rather than allow people the freedom of expression which is an integral (and in my opinion healthy) part of this boards modus operandi.

Direct, hostile, personal attacks get dealt with by the mods so I do not think the board needs a self appointed 'mother'. Perhaps if you focus on the content and substance of the debates rather than peoples individual style of posting, you may get more benefit (and less perceived hostility) out of your activity here.

Just a suggestion - not a whine! ;-)
'Church pictures are not always accurate' (The Nehor May 4th 2011)

Morality is doing what is right, regardless of what you are told.
Religion is doing what you are told, regardless of what is right.
_stemelbow
_Emeritus
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Re: Its been fun today

Post by _stemelbow »

jon wrote:Again why?
If you want softball questions and faith promoting answers and a place where hostility is dealt with by an iron fist then we all know the online location where that can be had.


I actually head over to that board at times. I'm not keen on the moderating. I'm not up on the attitude of many of the posters there, so I envision this place re-directing its course from being a more open rfm.

The rules here allow for assertive and aggressive questioning and debate. They allow for people being called out when they mislead, fudge or generally offer garbage in the place where facts should be.
People are allowed to express themselves and are allowed to be challenged. You are allowed to challenge people on wether or not they are whining.


I've already said I agree with the rules. I'm on board on that part of this board.

I don't see an environment that is hostile to participants.


Of courseyou don't. Sadly, that's the problem. Decent folks like you are a bit blinded by it all.

I see an environment that Mormonism may find hostile to the veracity of it's claims because facts can be openly expressed and debated without fear of censure.


Rarely do i see conversations take place where mere facts are discussed openly. That's the problem. I see hostility earmarking nearly every criticism. Pesonal jabs and attacks are frequent and very little listening or respect is given to those who defend. Indeed, at times, the defenders are often maligned, shouted out, and demonized. its not fun to watch. I wish others were wililng to open up and see it.

I suppose it's all about perception and people seeing what they want to see. You see hostility where I see people being open and candid.


There’s nothing mutually exclusive on this. One can be open and candid and still be hostile to others. I think that’s pretty common here.

You seem to want to 'cure' the board from things that you personally don't like, rather than allow people the freedom of expression which is an integral (and in my opinion healthy) part of this boards modus operandi.


You, uncharitably, misunderstand. I want the freedom of expression to remain but I also would enjoy by appealing to the decency of posters, that they participate sans the hostility, the disingenuous snobbiness, and the personal hostility that many a defender faces when one shows up.

Direct, hostile, personal attacks get dealt with by the mods so I do not think the board needs a self appointed 'mother'. Perhaps if you focus on the content and substance of the debates rather than peoples individual style of posting, you may get more benefit (and less perceived hostility) out of your activity here.

Just a suggestion - not a whine! ;-)


I’ve tried to play along as you have suggested. It only got worse. I’m sorry you miss it. I’m sorry you are unable or unwilling to see it. I think most if they were honest with themselves could recognize it. Its just obvious that there are plenty who are mad at the prospect of a change in the atmosphere. People like how its heavily favored towards hostility department. I get that. But I think if they were true to themselves they would prefer not to be so hostile. Indeed, ‘m sure most aren’t as hostile in person, but when anonymous on a message board, they seem to say what they please offend as they must with impunity.
Love ya tons,
Stem


I ain't nuttin'. don't get all worked up on account of me.
_Some Schmo
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Re: Its been fun today

Post by _Some Schmo »

stemelbow wrote: What can I do but offer my best effort to get people to see the problem. If they choose not to, no skin off my nose. I learned something anyway.

You should try to resist confusing your problem with a board problem. Take some responsibility for yourself.

*bracing self for another pep pep/whining accusation*
God belief is for people who don't want to live life on the universe's terms.
_jon
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Re: Its been fun today

Post by _jon »

Stem, you could choose to ignore what you perceive to be hostility.
'Church pictures are not always accurate' (The Nehor May 4th 2011)

Morality is doing what is right, regardless of what you are told.
Religion is doing what you are told, regardless of what is right.
_stemelbow
_Emeritus
Posts: 5872
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2011 8:40 pm

Re: Its been fun today

Post by _stemelbow »

jon wrote:Stem, you could choose to ignore what you perceive to be hostility.


I hate to be sarcastic, but no kidding. As I said, I've tried. I just think it lessens the ability to be productive here.
Love ya tons,
Stem


I ain't nuttin'. don't get all worked up on account of me.
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