Joseph Smith and Fanny...

[_why me]

I don't believe that Joseph Smith was a happy camper with polygamy.

http://www.lightplanet.com/Mormons/dail ... story.html

http://www.lightplanet.com/Mormons/dail ... kie_MD.htm

[_Drifting]

I don't believe that Joseph Smith was a happy camper with polygamy.

http://www.lightplanet.com/Mormons/dail ... story.html

http://www.lightplanet.com/Mormons/dail ... kie_MD.htm

Is that was he was doing in the barn, complaining...?

[_why me]

My question is, as you almost guessed, is one of disgust.

However, you make the point that the women and their husbands must have been loyal and faithful. Tell me, if requested, would you be prepared/faithful enough to give your wife up to Thomas S Monson?

I wasn't around at the time of Joseph Smith to know his heart and intent. However, I do not believe that it was one of lust and horn dogness. I also don't know what happened between Joseph Smith and the women involved. So I can't judge them. However, reading about zina I can see that it was all very complicated:

http://www.fairlds.org/FAIR_Conferences ... r_Men.html

And it doesn't seem like lust and horny toadiness was in the picture.

[_why me]

Is that was he was doing in the barn, complaining...?

I think that you need to read don bradley as pointed out by blixa to find the fanny story. He wrote a great essay but unfortunately I can't access it. Maybe someone can assess it and post it as a link.

[_Drifting]

Is that was he was doing in the barn, complaining...?

I think that you need to read don bradley as pointed out by blixa to find the fanny story. He wrote a great essay but unfortunately I can't access it. Maybe someone can assess it and post it as a link.

Would you do it?
If it became a requirement would you let Monson be sealed to your wife?

[_Blixa]

Is that was he was doing in the barn, complaining...?

I think that you need to read don bradley as pointed out by blixa to find the fanny story. He wrote a great essay but unfortunately I can't access it. Maybe someone can assess it and post it as a link.

I posted the best possible link to it already. You can't link to the "look inside" feature directly, which as I said will get you a lot, but not all of the essay. But, still enough to see some of the more intriguing points, including Don's very compelling argument about Fanny's pregnancy and a gloss on Cowdery's infamous "dirty, nasty, filthy affair" remark. It's an ingenious bit of historical research and whatever conclusions you draw about it, it makes a very provocative case for polygamy beginning earlier than usually supposed. I think Don will eventually develop this line of research even farther; I wish I had the money to fund historical research (in Mormon history and beyond). You can be assured if I ever come into wealth I will be underwriting scholarly grants first thing.

As for Emma's take on this and polygamy in general, it is an enormous loss to history that she did not write more about her experiences and thoughts. Mormon Enigma is a fascinating first crack at this important perspective, but it needs following up. I don't know what "Emma research" is currently ongoing, but I should ask around and find out. I have a few speculations myself that I'd be happy to share with fellow scholars; I don't have the time or resources to follow up this overlooked part of early Mormon history myself.

[_Dr. Shades]

Do you really believe that Joseph Smith would risk it all to bed other men's wives because of lust and horny dogness? None of women involved claimed such a motivation. That should tell you something.

Likewise, do you really believe that David Koresh would risk it all to bed other men's wives because of lust and horny dogness? None of women involved claimed such a motivation. That should tell you something.

[_sock puppet]

Were they married?

I think that's the million dollar question.

If I recall correctly, even Joseph admitted having relations with Fanny. But, were they married at the time or did he just claim they were after he got caught?

Couldn't Joseph Smith just make it a marriage by proclamation (being God's prophet and all)? "God says we're married" sine die. It's good to be a Prophet.

In what ways did JSJr commit to Fanny and these other, non-Emma women that a man committing adultery does not?

[_sock puppet]

Joseph was truly a lucky man to have God around to back him up on what ever he did.

He was actually a very unlucky man. But he received inspiration for plural marriage through reading the old testament, I believe.

Did he also think donkeys talked, through reading the old testament?

[_sock puppet]

Do you really believe that Joseph Smith would risk it all to bed other men's wives because of lust and horny dogness? None of women involved claimed such a motivation. That should tell you something.

Likewise, do you really believe that David Koresh would risk it all to bed other men's wives because of lust and horny dogness? None of women involved claimed such a motivation. That should tell you something.

Dr Shades, I have appreciated your recent parallel drawing between JSJr and David Koresh. For years, I'd drawn parallels between JSJr and Jim Jones, but JSJr only had one other die with him (Hyrum Smith). For Jim Jones, it was hundreds.

Koresh is a much closer analog to JSJr.

Thank you.