Joseph Smith Legacy (Consolidation)

[_Ceeboo]

Good day all.

In an effort to not detract further from the OP's of a few current/ongoing threads that I have been having discussions in: This thread is an effort to consolidate them, extend the courtesy to SockPuppet, Rambo, DadofMormon, Honor, Stem, Buffalo, and any others who may be interested (in the form of responses/dialouge to those who posted to me) to continued sharing on one single thread.

Table setting:
On another thread, I had offered my opinion/statement on the following things.
1. LDS to Atheist is a very sad and far too common scenario
2. This (#1), in my opinion, is the saddest legacy of Joseph Smith
(If there are other things that should be on the table, please let me know)

First, although I think that some were offended by #1 or #2 or both (I honestly do not know?), I want to make it clear that it was not my intention to offend and I do indeed apologize to any/all who were taken back by my comments.

Next: I will be/am very happy to offer anyone the common courtesy to disagree with my opinion. Please understand that my opinion is formed as a believer (I am well aware of the strong bias that this can lend) as well as several years of playing on these religious boards. (This is not, by any means, to imply that I am right in my opinion. It is, however, my opinion. Fair?)

I will stop here to allow my friends an opportunity to contribute, disagree, and/or take this disussion in a direction of their choice.

Peace,
Ceeboo

[_Themis]

If one can be open minded enough to see that their religion is false, then they will probably be open minded about other religions as well. I think this legacy you see is probably common among other groups who hold themselves up as the one true religion.

[_Buffalo]

I wasn't personally offended by your statement, but I thought it was a little offensive, in general, which is why I responded by turning it around against Catholicism.

I actually really like the pomp and symbolism and iconography and tradition of Catholicism. Some LDS turn Catholic when they leave, too.

All in all, atheism would be the safer rout for those who have children of alter boy age - you have to at least agree with that.

[_Buffalo]

If one can be open minded enough to see that their religion is false, then they will probably be open minded about other religions as well. I think this legacy you see is probably common among other groups who hold themselves up as the one true religion.

If you're an LDS missionary, you encounter a lot of other religions and you can easily find a lot of reasons why they're false (though of course at the time you won't subject Mormonism to the same scrutiny).

So when you stop believing in Mormonism, it's from a position of having already examined the warts of other churches, oftentimes.

[_stemelbow]

Table setting:
On another thread, I had offered my opinion/statement on the following things.
1. LDS to Atheist is a very sad and far too common scenario
2. This (#1), in my opinion, is the saddest legacy of Joseph Smith
(If there are other things that should be on the table, please let me know)

I'm not offended in the least. I'm just confused why you put it on the legacy of Joseph Smith when many a Catholic and Protestant heads on over to the atheist side too, en masse, there are far more from those two camps than from the LDS camp.

If there is a legacy to be put on one person, I don't see why its put on Joseph Smith in your view. It seems to make little sense, so i asked and continue to ask.

[_Some Schmo]

I didn't find the comment offensive, just inaccurate.

[_Blixa]

Ceeboo:

I'm not sure where you're going with this. I think both assertions are based on generalities that while containing some truth (such as many exmormons end up not joining another church), miss a great deal of important nuance.

For example, I suspect that some time after their initial break with LDSism, some former Mormons find themselves interested in pursuits which have a spiritual dimension or some connection to their former belief whether within an organized religious institution or not. I find this far from sad.

Also, the "legacy" of Joseph Smith is a much more complex phenomenon than can be contained in a simple cause and effect statement. If you consider the robust, contradictory and incomplete nature of his thinking, teasing out his legacy is probably a more historically and culturally entangled project than you think.

Man is that he might have joy, after all.

[_Ceeboo]

Thanks for the responses.

I am going to ask a few questions (Mostly for my benefit, but perhaps they will allow for an enviornment to provide greater understanding/dialouge/perspective for all involved) That would be my hope/intent.

What would you suggest is the most common reason/reasons why people leave the LDS Church? (I am asking at the time they leave and not an evolving process over time after they have left)

What is the biggest reason/reasons (If you happen to agree with me) that X-LDS people are often on a warp speed tract to Atheism?

by the way: I would like to make it clear that I include Atheism/Agnostic as valid choices among the many choices/paths that we all have available to us.

Peace,
Ceeboo

[_Ceeboo]

Hey SS,

I didn't find the comment offensive, just inaccurate.

What did you find inaccurate? (This is a serious question)


Peace,
Ceeboo

[_Ceeboo]

Hey Blixa,

Ceeboo:

I'm not sure where you're going with this.

That makes two of us. :)

I think both assertions are based on generalities that while containing some truth (such as many exmormons end up not joining another church), miss a great deal of important nuance.

???
I'm not sure what you mean. Either it is true (Most X-LDS become Atheist) or it is not true. Yes?

For example, I suspect that some time after their initial break with LDSism, some former Mormons find themselves interested in pursuits which have a spiritual dimension or some connection to their former belief whether within an organized religious institution or not. I find this far from sad.

Cool!
Given you description, I find nothing even remotely sad about that either.

What I was talking about (As a believer), is that it is my opinion that it is sad to see someone who used to believe in a God/Creator, now no longer believe in a God/Creator for the reason (Perhaps the sole reason) of a human being/Church.
That's all.

Also, the "legacy" of Joseph Smith is a much more complex phenomenon than can be contained in a simple cause and effect statement. If you consider the robust, contradictory and incomplete nature of his thinking, teasing out his legacy is probably a more historically and culturally entangled project than you think.

I am certain that the legacy of Joseph Smith is at least as complex as you suggest. I was simply offering my opinion as to what I find to be his saddest portion of said legacy. (Opinion only)

Man is that he might have joy, after all.

Indeed :) (Woman too)

Peace,
Ceeboo