The purpose of life is to know God and to make God known.

[_sock puppet]

I am starting this a separate thread, so as not to hijack the one recently started by thews.

In a response to thews' OP, MsJack stated

The purpose of life is to know God and to make God known.

I for one find God rather obtuse, and if He is omniscient and omnipotent, then it would seem intentionally so. If He wanted, God could make himself more easily accessible and easier to be known. So, with this background, I ask:

1-Is knowing God and making God known a purpose of life that God has assigned or is it one that as a believer, might become the believer's self-determined purpose of life?

1a-If the answer to #1 is God assigned, then why do you think He does not make himself more clearly and/or obviously known to us?

2-Do you think it is easy is to misunderstand God?

2a-If the answer to #2 is yes, do you think that the consequence of misunderstanding God is simply that it will take longer for such person to come to a correct understanding of God but that the person will be allowed the time to do so or will there be a hard and fast cut-off date for getting it right or else... ?

3-Once a correct understanding of God is achieved by a person, then what?

[_huckelberry]

I liked Jersey Girls comment:
"I could go with what Ms Jack said, but I'll add something else here instead.

I think the essential purpose of life is to love and take care of each other"

I thnk that loving and caring for each other is absolutely the only path upon which we can know God. If you only know a bunch of right religious answers you know nothing about God. I think that is the reason God is not invested in making sure everybody knows the dogma quiz.

I have real reservations about summerizing the purpose of life. It always narrows the view down too much and leaves some of the fullness of life out. Friends are not just to care for but to enjoy being with.

That might be why even the rather sober minded Westminister confession which is in the background of Ms Jacks phrase adds to knowing God the phrase, enjoying him forever.

[_quark]

If God was just a normal person (which is still on the table since nobody can prove he/she isn't), then I think the purpose would have very little to do with God. Rather, the purpose might have to do with what is like God. I'm with Huckleberry on the love idea.

[_LDSToronto]

There is no purpose to life other than the one we create. That's what I think. Here are some other great thinkers:

Forgive, O Lord, my little jokes on Thee,
And I'll forgive Thy great big one on me.
~Robert Frost, "Cluster of Faith," 1962

You fall out of your mother's womb, you crawl across open country under fire, and drop into your grave. ~Quentin Crisp

I think I've discovered the secret of life - you just hang around until you get used to it. ~Charles Schulz

You live and learn. At any rate, you live. ~Douglas Adams

H.

[_sock puppet]

There is no purpose to life other than the one we create. That's what I think. Here are some other great thinkers:

Forgive, O Lord, my little jokes on Thee,
And I'll forgive Thy great big one on me.
~Robert Frost, "Cluster of Faith," 1962

For some reason, the word cluster jumped out at me.

[_Gadianton]

By any familiar definition of "know" I don't think this is possible. Even assuming there is a God. Given the tremendous disparity between God's knowledge and power and ours, the main problem is that fostering any kind of relationship with God whereby we can say we "know" him becomes counterproductive for God.

I agree with SP that God could help us out a bit more. For instance, God could tell me the best pesticide to use for my backyard or explain the nuances of the evap tests my car runs so I can find a mechanic who can fix my check-engine light properly. But God is so far beyond me that by fixing these problems -- the problems I think I have -- he is straightening deck chairs on the Titanic. But the upshot is this kind of relation would approximate knowing someone on adult level and maintaining a friendship. It just can't be. Given the inequality between us, we simply can't have this friendship.

In the next pass, I ask God for help with my problems, but God gives me answers that defy my intuition while securing either my benefit, what's best for humanity, or his own decided ends based on his perfect understanding of everything. So rather than recommending pesticides, he gives me rain boots to wear next Tuesday. I wear them grudgingly, but an unexpected flash flood comes whereby I am a position to save someone stranded on the freeway and lesson learned about what is really important in life -- aside from the fact the rain would have washed away any spraying I would have done. This is a faith-based relationship where I would know God like a child knows his parents. The child doesn't understand, but makes the causal connections between obedience and things working out even if he doesn't always get what he wants. But this "knowing" of God is less than the above version. Ok, but does such knowledge slowly work to the above? No. Because the disparity between God's wisdom and our parents' wisdom is orders of magnitude and we can't reverse engineer it as we ultimately do in the case of our parents as we grow. Absent that possibility, this faith/reward system is bad for God.

If faith-based rewards are there for the taking, our "faith" is little more than a way to beat the system. We realize we don't understand what we're up against but by blindly following instructions from the one person who has this understanding, things work out. So we become nothing more than good monkeys and therefore, God must nuance his hand further. This problem is revealed not only when he answers questions, but when he dispenses feelings. For instance, if every time we became overwhelmed and prayed and God gave us peace so that we can solve our problems ourselves the next day, he'd be creating a society of drug addicts. So not only is knowing why his decisions work out of the question, knowing they work is out is too.

So for the next pass, I ask God for help, but the answers don't come in a way that I can turn God into a magic 8 ball to beat the system. Thus, my knowledge of him is even less than the above cases. I ask for my sick child to live, but he dies and all I feel is emptiness. My faith here turns explicitly on the fact that I don't know God at all. He's not giving me answers or comfort, but I assume that he's done the math and everything will work out for the best in the long run. Because I make this assumption, I don't go out and gun down my neighbors in anger. In the rare event that he does give an answer or supply a shot of dopamine, he'll withhold intervention in future scenarios so I can't pin him down. This works out for him because it maximizes the possibility I become responsible. But it explicitly implies that to achieve his purpose, we can't know God, at all. The only other option is to define knowledge of or friendship with God as ignorance of God and play off a mystical-sounding reversal.

[_Nightlion]

By any familiar definition of "know" I don't think this is possible. Even assuming there is a God. Given the tremendous disparity between God's knowledge and power and ours, the main problem is that fostering any kind of relationship with God whereby we can say we "know" him becomes counterproductive for God.

I agree with SP that God could help us out a bit more. For instance, God could tell me the best pesticide to use for my backyard or explain the nuances of the evap tests my car runs so I can find a mechanic who can fix my check-engine light properly. But God is so far beyond me that by fixing these problems -- the problems I think I have -- he is straightening deck chairs on the Titanic. But the upshot is this kind of relation would approximate knowing someone on adult level and maintaining a friendship. It just can't be. Given the inequality between us, we simply can't have this friendship.

In the next pass, I ask God for help with my problems, but God gives me answers that defy my intuition while securing either my benefit, what's best for humanity, or his own decided ends based on his perfect understanding of everything. So rather than recommending pesticides, he gives me rain boots to wear next Tuesday. I wear them grudgingly, but an unexpected flash flood comes whereby I am a position to save someone stranded on the freeway and lesson learned about what is really important in life -- aside from the fact the rain would have washed away any spraying I would have done. This is a faith-based relationship where I would know God like a child knows his parents. The child doesn't understand, but makes the causal connections between obedience and things working out even if he doesn't always get what he wants. But this "knowing" of God is less than the above version. Ok, but does such knowledge slowly work to the above? No. Because the disparity between God's wisdom and our parents' wisdom is orders of magnitude and we can't reverse engineer it as we ultimately do in the case of our parents as we grow. Absent that possibility, this faith/reward system is bad for God.

If faith-based rewards are there for the taking, our "faith" is little more than a way to beat the system. We realize we don't understand what we're up against but by blindly following instructions from the one person who has this understanding, things work out. So we become nothing more than good monkeys and therefore, God must nuance his hand further. This problem is revealed not only when he answers questions, but when he dispenses feelings. For instance, if every time we became overwhelmed and prayed and God gave us peace so that we can solve our problems ourselves the next day, he'd be creating a society of drug addicts. So not only is knowing why his decisions work out of the question, knowing they work is out is too.

So for the next pass, I ask God for help, but the answers don't come in a way that I can turn God into a magic 8 ball to beat the system. Thus, my knowledge of him is even less than the above cases. I ask for my sick child to live, but he dies and all I feel is emptiness. My faith here turns explicitly on the fact that I don't know God at all. He's not giving me answers or comfort, but I assume that he's done the math and everything will work out for the best in the long run. Because I make this assumption, I don't go out and gun down my neighbors in anger. In the rare event that he does give an answer or supply a shot of dopamine, he'll withhold intervention in future scenarios so I can't pin him down. This works out for him because it maximizes the possibility I become responsible. But it explicitly implies that to achieve his purpose, we can't know God, at all. The only other option is to define knowledge of or friendship with God as ignorance of God and play off a mystical-sounding reversal.

Yeah, yeah, whatever. I bet what Ms Jack counts for knowing God and making him known is NOT what I count for the same. See, up there, in your words Gad, all you want is me, me, me, me, stuff. And then some. That is not knowing about God. If I have explained this once I have a thousand times on message boards. Everything in the hearts of men is enmity with God. Knowing God is after we lay down willingly all enmity and sue for peace with God, and he ratifies our treaty of pure and honest intent. That is the Gospel. This is life eternal( and the purpose thereof) to know God and Jesus Christ (adoption of grace) whom he has sent.
We can know God and become his friend. Eventually. To know him means that we recognize him not that we fully comprehend him. But we do recognize him better and better.

[_Drifting]

Here is what I 'know' about God.

He allows children to be abused.
Either He chooses to let it happen or He has created a world in which He is powerless to stop it happening.

"by their fruits..."