Drifting wrote: How would you prepare your nine year old daughter for having a pedophile sunday teacher?
First I do not know if the sunday school teacher is a pedophile. But to prepare a child one must have a talk with the child about what to recognize when adults interact with her or him and what to watch out for. And to let the child know that if anyone does any of the things that she or he needs to watch out for to tell me. This would have saved a lot of children in Sandusky's charity programs.
Also, a pedophile always has a first victim. So this means that a background check does not necessarily help.
But at the end of the day, we do need a certain level of trust or we are all doomed.
I intend to lay a foundation that will revolutionize the whole world. Joseph Smith We are “to feed the hungry, to clothe the naked, to provide for the widow, to dry up the tear of the orphan, to comfort the afflicted, whether in this church, or in any other, or in no church at all…” Joseph Smith
Giving credit where it is due, at least they immediately called the authorities. Too many cases like this (churches, Penn State, etc) get handled in house/swept under the rug.
It is my province to teach to the Church what the doctrine is. It is your province to echo what I say or to remain silent. Bruce R. McConkie
liz3564 wrote:Hoops, I understand Drifting's comment. It is more of a commentary on LDS culture.
All our lives we are taught that callings are given based on inspiration from the Holy Ghost.
When someone who is called as a Sunday School teacher does something like this, particularly to a child, it is extremely frustrating. This also goes to my thought that all people who are called to work with kids should have to go through a background check. It isn't a perfect solution, but is more than we have in place now.
There is no perfect solution, however, there are safeguards that can be put in place for the purpose of prevention.
1. State and Federal Background checks for each person who is called to work with children.
2. Rule in place to ensure that there are always 2 adults present when working with children with no exceptions. I would include Bishop's interviews in that category.
3. Classroom doors should be glass to allow full view of the room.
4. Children escorted to restrooms by parents prior to any activity, during activity or put in place restroom attendants.
5. Offer classes in preventing and reporting child abuse. You can have this taught through local agencies such as departments of social services, etc.
Does this seem like a lot of trouble? How much is it worth to people to prevent a child from a lifelong struggle with mental health issues or suicide?
Bottom line: Are the children worth protecting or not?
Failure is not falling down but refusing to get up.
Chinese Proverb
Drifting has made some excellent points here. Hoops, et al, the reason that this is more of a problem for the LDS is exactly as Drifting has said:
1) When a call is issued by a Bishop, Stake President, or General Authority, it is claimed that the call came by revelation. In other words, the Holy Ghost told the church official exactly who should be in a calling.
2) The LDS believe in continuing revelation, especially for those in stewardship callings - those callings that give one authority over certain areas and the people within those areas. For example, if I am the Ward Mission Leader, I am entitled to revelation about missionary work in the geographical area of my ward, and I am entitled to revelation concerning those who are working under me (ward missionaries).
Both of these pose a significant problem for the LDS when a Primary Teacher, called by revelation directly from God via the Holy Ghost, rapes a 9 year old child. Why Me suggests that we have agency and so that entitles us to really rotten things. That is true. We have agency and if a primary teacher uses that agency to rape children, well, what could anyone do about it, let alone God - how could he possible do anything about it without robbing the rapist of his agency?
Well, as it turns, plenty:
1) God, via the Holy Ghost, could alert the parents of the child. The parents, using their agency, could act on those promptings or ignore those promptings.
2) God, via the Holy Ghost, could alert the bishop of the abuse. The bishop, using his agency, could act on those promptings or ignore those promptings.
3) God via the Holy Ghost, could alert the Primary President of the abuse. The Primary President, using her agency, could act on those promptings or ignore those promptings.
Certainly we've all heard talks about keys lost and then found, cars that wouldn't start then miraculously starting, general authorities finding hotels in snowstorms, $5 dollars found in a pocket when needed, and on and on and on. The real tragedy here is God, via the Holy Ghost, did not alert anyone to the fact that this child was getting raped. Or maybe He did, and no one listened - but isn't that odd? I mean, God spoke clear enough when this rapist was called as a primary teacher; it follows God would be screaming if a child was suffering.
Of course, we've also heard faith-promoting stories of people overcoming incredible trials. A cynic might say that this child was raped for their own good - this is just a challenge for the child to overcome, to make them stronger.
I mean, there sure does seem to be a lot of room for improvement with this LDS theology of continuing revelation.....
H.
"Others cannot endure their own littleness unless they can translate it into meaningfulness on the largest possible level." ~ Ernest Becker "Whether you think of it as heavenly or as earthly, if you love life immortality is no consolation for death." ~ Simone de Beauvoir
liz3564 wrote:Hoops, I understand Drifting's comment. It is more of a commentary on LDS culture.
All our lives we are taught that callings are given based on inspiration from the Holy Ghost.
When someone who is called as a Sunday School teacher does something like this, particularly to a child, it is extremely frustrating. This also goes to my thought that all people who are called to work with kids should have to go through a background check. It isn't a perfect solution, but is more than we have in place now.
There is no perfect solution, however, there are safeguards that can be put in place for the purpose of prevention.
1. State and Federal Background checks for each person who is called to work with children.
2. Rule in place to ensure that there are always 2 adults present when working with children with no exceptions. I would include Bishop's interviews in that category.
3. Classroom doors should be glass to allow full view of the room.
4. Children escorted to restrooms by parents prior to any activity, during activity or put in place restroom attendants.
5. Offer classes in preventing and reporting child abuse. You can have this taught through local agencies such as departments of social services, etc.
Does this seem like a lot of trouble? How much is it worth to people to prevent a child from a lifelong struggle with mental health issues or suicide?
Bottom line: Are the children worth protecting or not?
Jersey Girl,
I agree with you. So does the LDS church. A recent memo to stake president's and bishops stated that:
1. All classrooms have either open doors or glass windows 2. Paired teaching when men are called as Primary Teachers 3. Children are escorted to the washroom by parents prior to classes beginning
All leaders are trained in how to recognize and report child abuse - the church has a video that they show once a year to all ward councils.
Guess it's not working, huh?
H.
"Others cannot endure their own littleness unless they can translate it into meaningfulness on the largest possible level." ~ Ernest Becker "Whether you think of it as heavenly or as earthly, if you love life immortality is no consolation for death." ~ Simone de Beauvoir
"Anger" doesn't even begin to describe (which is where I think Liz and Jersey Girl are as well).
Yeah, get this.
The majority of my adult life has been dedicated to children.
According to the article, the rape took place in the church building. I am disgusted by the massive stupidity of people who talk a good one and put nothing in place to prevent such acts from taking place.
This should have NEVER taken place inside a church building. The powers that be in SLC should be embarrassed and ashamed for not taking child safety seriously.
They can regulate the damn holes in your ears but they cannot provide for the children!
Suffer the little children...how about making it safe for the little children?
Failure is not falling down but refusing to get up.
Chinese Proverb
Perhaps God could stop calling people to Primary or Youth callings if they are prone to pedophile type inclinations - that might just help.
“We look to not only the spiritual but also the temporal, and we believe that a person who is impoverished temporally cannot blossom spiritually.” Keith McMullin - Counsellor in Presiding Bishopric
"One, two, three...let's go shopping!" Thomas S Monson - Prophet, Seer, Revelator
I agree with you. So does the LDS church. A recent memo to stake president's and bishops stated that:
1. All classrooms have either open doors or glass windows
Good. Who is monitoring the classrooms?
2. Paired teaching when men are called as Primary Teachers
There should be paired teaching, period.
3. Children are escorted to the washroom by parents prior to classes beginning
What about during the activity? Who takes them then?
All leaders are trained in how to recognize and report child abuse - the church has a video that they show once a year to all ward councils.
The church has a video? Who made this video?
I want to see training that involves the state statues, the penalities for not reporting child abuse, videos put on by social service agencies, including graphic photographs, to whom child abuse is reported.
I want to see each person finger printed and subjected to two criminal background checks via state and federal agencies.
And nothing short of that will do.
Failure is not falling down but refusing to get up.
Chinese Proverb