When Good Mormon Men Go Bad

[_sock puppet]

Just because the Church contains people like YOU, people who have their own minds and interests, who don't care about the Church,.....

Do you really believe that those that have their own minds and interests are an anathema to the Church? If so, we agree on that. Individuality and the Church are at contrary purposes.

My "well respected" and loved Eternal Companion committed adultery with two different men 8 times, belittled me our entire marriage, destroyed our finances with an MLM obsession to get rich, lost our house, caused me to loose my job, destroyed our credit, and then ran off to Malaysia with my three little children.

I am sorry to hear that, truly. by the way, would you mind disclosing which MLM that was?

Is what she did the Churches fault? No..... She was simply a person without true character and CHOSE HERSELF who she wanted to be. Right now, she is back in the states, and no consequences at all for her actions, not even from the Church. Even that's not necessarily the Churches fault, she used the system to her advantage, and "confessed" while she was in Malaysia, so I was not able to give testimony.

The Church is that system. If there was divine guidance--the boogeyman it claims in order to achieve one's subjugation to others in that hierarchy--then even those Malaysian church leaders would have had the power of discernment. There are also telephones and if necessary, language interpreters. The Church is at fault. If it did not merely want to keep her as a tithe payer and keep her as an example of how other Malaysian members could go to the U.S. via their Church connection--and of course, the local Church leaders there like the subservience of her 'confession' to them--then the Church would have mechanisms in place for having heard your evidence.

How did you meet and choose to marry this now ex-wife? Was it the Church?

Unfortunately, there is not much the Church can do.
Unless people are honest, and testimony is given, then there is simply not much the Church can do, especially getting in the middle of personal relationships.

Agreed. The Church is just an organization, and quite the paper tiger at that. Without its much ballyhooed discernment by god-inspired leaders, it is itself a MLM company, nothing more. However, while there is not much it can do, the Church is at fault for having suckered members in and kept them with false expectations.

I sent a 7 page letter to my ex's leaders in Malaysia, and also created a 50 point list of all her sins, yet, her leaders there simply thought I was crazy. Had my ex however had remained in our original ward, and we had remained in the same city, she would have most certainly been excommunicated. Thus, it's not the Churches fault that she lives her life deceiving herself and others.

See above.

I finally found someone I could stay with and over Christmas and I'm going to Provo where she now is to see my 3 little boys for the first time in over 2 years.

I hope that your visit is a successful parent-children one.

So much more to the story, but it's like she has a split personality. That's not the Churches fault.And? There are bad people in the Church..... Still not the Churches fault.

Personally I think you're sexist.... and applying your anti-mormon bigotry on the Church you are completely ignorant of.

You are wrong..... It's not damaged by the LDS Church, it's damaged caused by sinful men and women, which YES, the Church does contain, no matter how better it is compared to others. There are still humans in it. The vast majority however are faithful, good, sincere, etc. and try to do their best, even though they make mistakes. People who manipulate [u]the system, who abuse others, they tend to leave the Church and become anti-mormons JUST LIKE YOU[/u].....

I agree that it is not the Church's fault she has a split personality, but didn't the priesthood blessings correct that? Jesus cured people, cured lepers, but can't fuse a split personality back together? Sure can't, because there is nothing supernatural about the Church. It is an MLM company that has a lot of folks hood-winked, what with claims of Jesus at the helm, leaders having divine discernment, and priesthood blessing curing people of their ailments. This illusion has been being perpetrated for 181 years now. Poppycock.

[_sock puppet]

LDST makes a good point about rumors.

As I read this thread, it struck me that I do not know the dirty laundry of my neighbors, not even that of those Mormons that live in the ward or stake boundaries in which I live. Their sex lives are theirs.

The Church causes each other's sex lives to become the business of many of the members. The bishop is asking young boys if they are wankers, and young girls about pleasuring themselves. Rumors are rampant about others' sex lives, as witnessed by all the stories related in just this thread. SWK was obsessed with sex and what Church members might be doing. His soul was obviously tormented to think there might be sexual fun and relief that others might be enjoying.

It is a fine legacy for, as they say, Holy Horny Joe. His Church continues in his footsteps.

[_DrW]

LDSFAQS,

I am truly sorry to hear that your wife left you after ruining your finances, and that she took your children overseas with her. I cannot imagine what it would be like to try and pick up the pieces after a string of events like that in one's life.

With regard to the OP, I am certainly not blaming the Church for the fact that some men in it behave badly. My problem is with what (in my experience) comes next, which is essentially nothing in terms of negative consequences for sufficiently successful men as far as the Church is concerned.

In the most recent case I mentioned, the husband (who I have worked with and know very well and will probably end up testifying against in court) simply demanded that his wife and female children leave the family home.

Although the husband had no legal right to kick his wife and two daughters out of the home, the wife left because she was following the counsel of the Church to obey her husband, (and she didn't know any better). She called us about 11:00 one night from the Church parking lot, said that she her and the girls had been kicked out of their home and asked if we knew of a woman's shelter where they could spend the night. We decided that they would stay with us and I had to go pick them up from the Church parking lot because they did not want their car parked at our home (which is not far from their home).

My problem here is that this individual can abandon the females in his family and literally refuse to support them while facing no negative consequences or sanctions from the Church.

Meanwhile the wife and female children are forced to move to another ward where they have no support group. This is especially troubling because the LDS Church constituted the main social network for the husband (who also had his work) and the only social network for his TBM wife, who home-schooled all of their five children, two of whom are now at BYU.

(And in case you are wondering, this woman is a 5' 7" marathon runner. She is thin, physically fit, and attractive. People often mistake her and her teenage daughter for sisters.)

As far as "the other side of the story", there is none. The husband found someone he was more attracted to at work and figured out a way to shed most of his responsibilities as a husband and father with minimal financial impact. Whether his plan will work or not remains to be seen. However, it is pretty clear that the Church will not stand in his way.

[_Drifting]

DrW,

One of the temple recommend questions is about wether you are up to date in supporting a previous spouse or children. If the man you speak of gets passed this interview successfully then either the Bishop has no inspiration from God or he is specifically and willingly ignoring Gods promptings on the matter - in which case his SP should get the feeling to go sack the Bishop.

The fact is, women are not seen in the same status as the men folk of the Church. If you are a temporally successful male you are of a higher status than a non successful male. The thought being that yourI righteousness in the Church makes you successful. Sad but true.

As an example, can you point out an Apostle that hasn't been temporally successful? No, neither can I. Mormons will point out that this is God blessing them for their righteousness and so the subconscious thought within the religion that successful men are better Priesthood holders is perpetuated.

[_harmony]

As an example, can you point out an Apostle that hasn't been temporally successful?

That would be Packer, who has supped at the tithing trough since the 60's. Before that, he was employed by CES.

[_Tarski]

I have never seen a more elementary and catastrophic example of the fallacy of hasty generalization in my entire life.

How odd that you should not see what is always right under your nose because you produce it whenever you rant about leftists.

[_Buffalo]

As an example, can you point out an Apostle that hasn't been temporally successful?

That would be Packer, who has supped at the tithing trough since the 60's. Before that, he was employed by CES.

Hinckley too. He was a corporate man (Corporation of the President) practically from the cradle to the grave.

[_Drifting]

Interestingly both Hinckley and Packer live(d) the lifestyle of the temporally successful Mormon man, significantly higher standards of living than the common members who paid their wages.

Packers profile from LDS.org
An educator by profession, his career includes service as supervisor of seminaries and institutes of religion for the Church and as a member of the Administrative Council of Brigham Young University.
He studied at Weber College and subsequently received his bachelor of science and master of science degrees from Utah State University. He received a doctorate in educational administration from Brigham Young University.
President Packer was born September 10, 1924, in Brigham City, Utah. He served as a bomber pilot during World War II in the Pacific

They make him sound temporally successful - an educator by profession etc.

[_ldsfaqs]

As an example, can you point out an Apostle that hasn't been temporally successful?

That would be Packer, who has supped at the tithing trough since the 60's. Before that, he was employed by CES.

I really wish you people would start being honest before your fellow men....

Top LDS leaders who get a "living stipend" get such through the Churches TAXED Business Holdings, not through "Tithing".

Tithing doesn't pay the leaders, and Tithing doesn't pay for shopping Malls, so will you people STOP LYING....???

[_Drifting]

I really wish you people would start being honest before your fellow men....

Top LDS leaders who get a "living stipend" get such through the Churches TAXED Business Holdings, not through "Tithing".

Tithing doesn't pay the leaders, and Tithing doesn't pay for shopping Malls, so will you people STOP LYING....???

Sorry, we should have said 'tithing or the proceeds of invested tithing'...

There is no money in the Church except what our members offer.

(Jeffrey R. Holland, Laie, Hawaii, 17 December 2011, in "BYU-Hawaii: Ground Broken for Campus Expansion Project," by Kelsey Royer, BYU-Hawaii University Communications, published in "Church News," Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, 13 December 2011, at: http://www.ldschurchnews.com/articles/6 ... oject.html)

Gordon B. Hinckley, prior President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, said:

Our major source of revenue is the ancient law of the tithe. Our people are expected to pay 10 percent of their income to move forward the work of the Church. The remarkable and wonderful thing is that they do it.