Civil Rights: Tool of Communist Deception

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_DarkHelmet
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Re: Civil Rights: Tool of Communist Deception

Post by _DarkHelmet »

Would Nephi have slain Laban if he put the love of neighbor above the love of God?

- Ezra Taft Benson


What a great quote. And it can be used by any violent religious person.

Would Al-Quaeda have succeeded in their mission on 9/11 if they put the love of neighbor above the love of God?
"We have taken up arms in defense of our liberty, our property, our wives, and our children; we are determined to preserve them, or die."
- Captain Moroni - 'Address to the Inhabitants of Canada' 1775
_Yahoo Bot
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Re: Civil Rights: Tool of Communist Deception

Post by _Yahoo Bot »

Runtu wrote:
Do you think the Civil Rights movement was ever dominated by Communists or had as its goals Communist revolution?

There's nothing disloyal or critical in saying that Benson got it wrong.


I've already gone on record above saying that I didn't like Benson's politics.
_Buffalo
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Re: Civil Rights: Tool of Communist Deception

Post by _Buffalo »

Yahoo Bot wrote:
Runtu wrote:
Do you think the Civil Rights movement was ever dominated by Communists or had as its goals Communist revolution?

There's nothing disloyal or critical in saying that Benson got it wrong.


I've already gone on record above saying that I didn't like Benson's politics.


So the Civil Rights movement wasn't a communist plot? We weren't in any real danger of having a "Negro Soviet Republic"?
Parley P. Pratt wrote:We must lie to support brother Joseph, it is our duty to do so.

B.R. McConkie, © Intellectual Reserve wrote:There are those who say that revealed religion and organic evolution can be harmonized. This is both false and devilish.
_Yahoo Bot
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Re: Civil Rights: Tool of Communist Deception

Post by _Yahoo Bot »

Buffalo wrote:
So the Civil Rights movement wasn't a communist plot? We weren't in any real danger of having a "Negro Soviet Republic"?


Have a hard time reading my responses?
_Buffalo
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Re: Civil Rights: Tool of Communist Deception

Post by _Buffalo »

Yahoo Bot wrote:
Buffalo wrote:
So the Civil Rights movement wasn't a communist plot? We weren't in any real danger of having a "Negro Soviet Republic"?


Have a hard time reading my responses?


I was just hoping that you could vouchsafe that I understand your position correctly.
Parley P. Pratt wrote:We must lie to support brother Joseph, it is our duty to do so.

B.R. McConkie, © Intellectual Reserve wrote:There are those who say that revealed religion and organic evolution can be harmonized. This is both false and devilish.
_Yahoo Bot
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Re: Civil Rights: Tool of Communist Deception

Post by _Yahoo Bot »

So, if I say, "I don't eat pork," you want to force me to say, "I don't eat pork fattened at Church welfare farms." Ok, I get it.
_Morley
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Re: Civil Rights: Tool of Communist Deception

Post by _Morley »

Yahoo Bot wrote:.... But, when blacks overcame their revulsion to the Democratic Party (around the time of John F. Kennedy and Lyndon Johnson; the Democrats were the party of the Klan), the communists lost their influence.


The African-American move toward the Democratic Party began considerably before the presidencies of Kennedy and Johnston (though those administrations did cement it). FDR gets the credit for pulling blacks away from the Republican Party. They never went back.
_DarkHelmet
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Re: Civil Rights: Tool of Communist Deception

Post by _DarkHelmet »

Morley wrote:
Yahoo Bot wrote:.... But, when blacks overcame their revulsion to the Democratic Party (around the time of John F. Kennedy and Lyndon Johnson; the Democrats were the party of the Klan), the communists lost their influence.


The African-American move toward the Democratic Party began considerably before the presidencies of Kennedy and Johnston (though those administrations did cement it). FDR gets the credit for pulling blacks away from the Republican Party. They never went back.


In the 60s, the Democrats had a coalition that included both blacks and southern rednecks. Southerners would never vote for the party of Lincoln. In the 80s, Reagan brought the southern rednecks, a.k.a. Dixiecrats to the Republican side.
"We have taken up arms in defense of our liberty, our property, our wives, and our children; we are determined to preserve them, or die."
- Captain Moroni - 'Address to the Inhabitants of Canada' 1775
_Buffalo
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Re: Civil Rights: Tool of Communist Deception

Post by _Buffalo »

Yahoo Bot wrote:So, if I say, "I don't eat pork," you want to force me to say, "I don't eat pork fattened at Church welfare farms." Ok, I get it.


So the Civil Rights movement WAS a communist plot? We WERE in real danger of having a "Negro Soviet Republic"?
Parley P. Pratt wrote:We must lie to support brother Joseph, it is our duty to do so.

B.R. McConkie, © Intellectual Reserve wrote:There are those who say that revealed religion and organic evolution can be harmonized. This is both false and devilish.
_Droopy
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Re: Civil Rights: Tool of Communist Deception

Post by _Droopy »

The problem, of course, is that black Americans were deliberately and systematically excluded from the "very constitutional and liberal system" you speak of. Denied property rights, voting rights, and even the freedom to go where they wished, there was very little recourse within the existing political structures of the United States except to protest peacefully, which they did.


As I mentioned above. In any case, you seem to have missed the point here. Within the Declaration and Constitution lay Black's only real hopes of ever enjoying, and enjoying to a degree not possible anywhere else, the freedoms to which they had equal claim.

Had it not been for the Devil's bargain that had to be carved out with the South to preserve the union at its inception, I think it very likely that slavery would have been abolished not long after 1789. The strong resistance to black equality was not a feature of any inherent defect in the principles of the Founding, but of the powerful holdovers of the ancien regime that the Declaration and Constitution were created to ultimately overcome and move beyond.

The Civil Rights movement may have included socialists, but their goal was the civil rights they were entitled to under the law, not socialism. Bringing up Robeson as representative of the broader movement is like saying all Mormons are Native American-worshiping vegans from Utah County.


I don't think You're aware of the relevant history here, Runtu. The civil rights movement was infiltrated and substantively influenced by radical elements through the sixties and, at least until King's death, with little impact in the mainstream of the movement (King himself, however, seems to have been deeply influenced by it towards the end of his life).

After King, as the black liberation or black power movement came to dominate civil rights discourse, any such clandestine behavior became all but moot. Jesse Jackson became the self and media appointed heir apparent to King, and the "civil rights" movement withered rapidly on the vine.

In the thirties, the height of communist influence within government and the American political scene generally, there was no civil rights movement per se, but there were a number of organizations, including the Communist party of the United States, who used racism and the oppression of black American's as a wedge with which to divide black Americans from America and its institutions (those that held out the most hope and promise) and move them toward totalitarian collectivism.

What prevailed after the Civil War is a society that excluded its black citizens from participation in the system.


You apparently have missed the point again.

The Civil Rights movement was not, as a whole, anti-capitalist.


Agreed.

The reason it arose is that "classical liberalism," in the form of American republican democracy, had failed to equalize the racial barriers.


Wrong. When the civil rights movement began in the fifties, rock&roll, like Swing and other musical forms before it, substantially opened up doors for blacks, segregated and thought of as inferior as they still were, to real opportunity and wealth. By the early sixties, and before the beginning of the Great Society, blacks were moving into the middle class at a substantial rate through a general movement into the economic American mainstream. Yes, these blacks were still segregated from whites and thought of as somehow different and inferior, but the empirical realities are what they are, nonetheless.

"Capitalism" was treating ever more blacks to the American dream, as time went on. The problem was cultural, a long, dark cultural lag held over from the old ideas and cultural forms of old Europe that became settled in the South, but progressively abandoned in the North and West at a much faster rate. Ethnocentrism is an ago old attitude, and took a long time to erase in spite of free market democratic capitalism and in spite of the principles of the Founding to which they were inescapably in conflict. Don't confuse "capitalism," which isn't a "system" of anything, but simply liberty in the economic realm, with long lagging cultural biases, which do involve systems of exclusion and bias among human beings.

Either that, or President Benson was prone to see communists in movements he didn't particularly like.


Benson said himself that there was nothing wrong with the civil rights movement per se.

Now there is nothing wrong with civil rights--it is what's being done in the name of civil rights that is alarming.


Mind read if you must.
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 21, 2011 8:33 pm, edited 4 times in total.
Nothing is going to startle us more when we pass through the veil to the other side than to realize how well we know our Father [in Heaven] and how familiar his face is to us

- President Ezra Taft Benson


I am so old that I can remember when most of the people promoting race hate were white.

- Thomas Sowell
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