reasons for leaving the church

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_Yoda

Re: reasons for leaving the church

Post by _Yoda »

harmony wrote:
Corpsegrinder wrote: True believing Mormons, behind the cheerful façade, are tense, stressed-out, and generally unhappy.


This is not true of the believing Mormons I know (but I don't live in Zion).


Agreed. In my experience, it's about 50/50.

Of course, I don't live in Zion, either. LOL
_Buffalo
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Re: reasons for leaving the church

Post by _Buffalo »

Probably if you were unhappy as a Mormon, you'll be more motivated to do some background checks on its truth claims. And if you do that, you're way more likely to stop believing in them, as they don't pass muster.
Parley P. Pratt wrote:We must lie to support brother Joseph, it is our duty to do so.

B.R. McConkie, © Intellectual Reserve wrote:There are those who say that revealed religion and organic evolution can be harmonized. This is both false and devilish.
_harmony
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Re: reasons for leaving the church

Post by _harmony »

just me wrote:Things NOT to say, or any variation like unto it:

*I don't know who you are anymore
*I'm disappointed in you
*You are leaving the church to sin
*You are a tool of the devil
*Satan got you
*Our relationship is ruined
*You are choosing to be gay


Good list, JM.

Other things to not say:

You are destroying our family.
Mom is crying and it's all your fault.
I don't believe you.
(Nevo, Jan 23) And the Melchizedek Priesthood may not have been restored until the summer of 1830, several months after the organization of the Church.
_DarkHelmet
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Re: reasons for leaving the church

Post by _DarkHelmet »

One thing TBMs need to realize is the 11th article of faith applies to everyone, not just Mormons. There is no right or wrong reason to leave any organization. If a person wants to become a Mormon, that's their business regardless of the reason. If a person wants to leave Mormonism, it's their business regardless of the reason. This isn't the Middle East.
"We have taken up arms in defense of our liberty, our property, our wives, and our children; we are determined to preserve them, or die."
- Captain Moroni - 'Address to the Inhabitants of Canada' 1775
_Buffalo
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Re: reasons for leaving the church

Post by _Buffalo »

DarkHelmet wrote:One thing TBMs need to realize is the 11th article of faith applies to everyone, not just Mormons. There is no right or wrong reason to leave any organization. If a person wants to become a Mormon, that's their business regardless of the reason. If a person wants to leave Mormonism, it's their business regardless of the reason. This isn't the Middle East.


Unfortunately there is a long history in Mormonism of persecuting people who stop believing, from stealing their belongings and driving them out, to outright murder, to the modern practice of shunning.
Parley P. Pratt wrote:We must lie to support brother Joseph, it is our duty to do so.

B.R. McConkie, © Intellectual Reserve wrote:There are those who say that revealed religion and organic evolution can be harmonized. This is both false and devilish.
_beastie
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Re: reasons for leaving the church

Post by _beastie »

The list of problems with LDS beliefs that could justify loss of faith is very long. There is no way to predict what will be on your sister's list. Your job is to listen and to assure her that, no matter how your beliefs may diverge, you will always love her and welcome her in your life.

Personally, I think you shouldn't even ask her "why". The problem with asking is that then she'll give you her list, and you will end up feeling attacked because your most cherished beliefs are being so harshly criticized by someone who has rejected those beliefs - and that often feels very personal to Mormons. So you'll respond defensively and then she'll feel attacked and criticized. It is a no win situation.
We hate to seem like we don’t trust every nut with a story, but there’s evidence we can point to, and dance while shouting taunting phrases.

Penn & Teller

http://www.mormonmesoamerica.com
_Lizard Jew
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Re: reasons for leaving the church

Post by _Lizard Jew »

Buffalo wrote:
Lizard Jew wrote:can you talk more about this?


Which part - scientific conflict or Deutero-Isaiah?

the second one. how do they think they know its written later?
john 3:16 is overused.
_Lizard Jew
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Re: reasons for leaving the church

Post by _Lizard Jew »

honorentheos wrote:Lizard Jew,

Have you ever had an extended discussion with one of these people online or at least read in detail what they think on any of the specific subjects that interest you regarding LDS history?

not really. its a recent interest.
john 3:16 is overused.
_Lizard Jew
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Re: reasons for leaving the church

Post by _Lizard Jew »

just me wrote:I don't understand.

You mom told you your sister is gay.

You now assume that she will leave the church because of it.

YOU want to initiate an email conversation with her about...what?...her "problems?"

You want us to help you know how to come back against any criticism she may launch against the church?

How old is she? How old are you?

Your sister just did what is likely the most difficult thing she has ever done in her LIFE.

Please just email her and tell her that you love her and accept her. I also suggest that you capitalize the first letter of every sentence and all of your I's. ;)

IF (and that is a big if) she tells you that she is upset about the way the church treats gays tell her that you are sorry that she is hurting.

Things NOT to say, or any variation like unto it:

*I don't know who you are anymore
*I'm disappointed in you
*You are leaving the church to sin
*You are a tool of the devil
*Satan got you
*Our relationship is ruined
*You are choosing to be gay

sorry if i don't answer everything. i feel a little buried from all the people posting back.

is assuming she is going to leave really that controversial?

the church is no place for someone who is gay.

what fun is celibacy? i hope she leaves for her own sake. god will follow her wherever she goes.

we are getting together at the house for new years. my brother is flying in from nebraska and we will play cards together as we always do.
john 3:16 is overused.
_honorentheos
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Re: reasons for leaving the church

Post by _honorentheos »

Lizard Jew wrote:
honorentheos wrote:Lizard Jew,

Have you ever had an extended discussion with one of these people online or at least read in detail what they think on any of the specific subjects that interest you regarding LDS history?

not really. its a recent interest.

That's fair. I think it will be valuable in your continued exploration to consider what you mean that these persons "still believe" and if what they actually do believe corresponds well with your own beliefs. For me, it became quickly apparent the apologetic response to most historical issues relied heavily on a reinterpretation of the central belief.

by the way - your comment above about God going with your sister where ever she goes is a nice way to view it. Best wishes to you and your family.
The world is always full of the sound of waves..but who knows the heart of the sea, a hundred feet down? Who knows it's depth?
~ Eiji Yoshikawa
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