Is the Modern Mormon Church in Apostasy?

[_Zelder]

Here is what Joseph F. Smith had to say on the necessity of plural wives for exaltation.

Here is a quote from the journal of William Clayton on the same subject.

Well that's true. They did teach that is was necessary and J. Smith claimed that an angel made threats if he didn't. And again on the other hand the scripture makes no claimes. I supose a believer could argue that maybe it was necessary for some members but not all members or something of that nature. It does not make a damn bit of sense that polygyny is necessary because there are not enough women for all the men to have more than one. I think that polygynandry is a more realistic approach and might truely be necessary for the formation of a utopian society living the law of consecration. *shrugs* I see it all as a big mystery but maybe Joseph Smith was on to something important.

[_harmony]

I see it all as a big mystery but maybe Joseph Smith was on to something important.

What Joseph was "onto" was a way to have multiple women without supporting any of them.

What Joseph did was blasphemy. There is no "God" in Sex 132.

[Guest]

Well that's true. They did teach that is was necessary and J. Smith claimed that an angel made threats if he didn't. And again on the other hand the scripture makes no claimes. I supose a believer could argue that maybe it was necessary for some members but not all members or something of that nature. It does not make a damn bit of sense that polygyny is necessary because there are not enough women for all the men to have more than one. I think that polygynandry is a more realistic approach and might truly be necessary for the formation of a utopian society living the law of consecration. *shrugs* I see it all as a big mystery but maybe Joseph Smith was on to something important.

I still don't understand all that went on at that time but I believe Jason had it right when he pointed out that practicing polygamy used to be viewed in the LDS church (it still is by the FLDS) as the only way to achieve the highest glory of the Celestial Kingdom. So in that aspect the modern Church could be viewed as in apostasy from what J.S. and B.Y. taught. Certainly John Taylor was very clear on the subject when he said as much.

Edited to add the John Taylor 1886 revelation.

John Taylor Revelation on polygamy in 1886.


“Thus saith the Lord. All commandments that I give must be obeyed by those calling themselves by my name unless they are revoked by me or by my authority….I have not revoked this law nor will I for it is everlasting and those who will enter into my glory must obey the conditions thereof, even so amen.”

[_moksha]

Change is inevitable. To go against change is to rail against the wind. The true questions for current assessment should be whether we are kinder, gentler and do more good for the world than before. If we can answer yes, then we are on the path of Christ.

[_consiglieri]

Thanks for the reality check, Moksha.

You are one good . . . penguin.

Happy New Year!

--Consiglieri

[_bcspace]

The issue, I think, is that one could say the same thing about the LDS Church; that it was a very different Church in the early 19th century from the LDS Church exiting the 20th century.

One can't say that as doctrine hasn't changed in any real sense like the doctrine changed in early Christianity. Wait another 100 years and we'll see.

[_Morley]

No, just you are in many issues.....

Care to name one?

Your failure to reload your avatar.

[_sock puppet]

Here is what Joseph F. Smith had to say on the necessity of plural wives for exaltation.

Here is a quote from the journal of William Clayton on the same subject.

Well that's true. They did teach that is was necessary and J. Smith claimed that an angel made threats if he didn't. And again on the other hand the scripture makes no claimes. I supose a believer could argue that maybe it was necessary for some members but not all members or something of that nature. It does not make a damn bit of sense that polygyny is necessary because there are not enough women for all the men to have more than one. I think that polygynandry is a more realistic approach and might truly be necessary for the formation of a utopian society living the law of consecration. *shrugs* I see it all as a big mystery but maybe Joseph Smith was on to something important.

How about just old fashioned monogamy and fidelity? Seems much more practical, particularly given the virtual balance of male and female births. Why does god need--and thus require--anyone to be diddling more than just his wife or her husband (both singular) to be exalted?

The Abrahamic god made adultery and fornication a sin? Why if he is going to command someone to have a harem to be exalted?

COJCOLDS still does what it can to cover up JSJr's promiscuity (i.e., Mormon politically correct term, "polygamy") because it does not even have the hint of the faint badges of nobility that the polygamy of BY or JT had. JSJr's wandering eye is just that. He was doing it with other men's wives, with young girls, with sisters. As compared to defending the Utah polygamy, apologists face a daunting ascent up K2 in trying to defend Nauvoo polygamy as anything other than just an expression of JSJr's randy libido.

Poly--anything--is just an excuse invented by 'religious' people to commit adultery.

Mormons take the cake of rationalization among religionists. Murder is okay, if you claim it is 'blood atonement' or that it is necessary that an entire nation not wither in disbelief. Adultery is rationalized as God-commanded polygamy, required for man to get in heaven.

I am ashamed that I ever bought into the load of crap that is Mormonism.

[_ldsfaqs]

Care to name one?

You might remember me as "Obiwan" over at MA&DB.....
If so, then you know the many times I've chastised you for your anti-mormon views.
For a recent example, your despicable conversation with your daughter.
No good latter-day saint would have approached the issue that way, and fyi, there IS a way to have approached it without being intellectually and morally flawed according to modern social convention, as well as being true to the Church and the Gospel.

I once left the Church for the big three issues I had, Polygamy, and the Priesthood in relation to blacks and women. My judgment then was seriously flawed and ignorant, as yours is.

[_zeezrom]

Heavenly Mother reigns with power in the high heavens. Every knee shall bow and every tongue confess that She is God.