Status of Book of Mormon Claims

[_MCB]

Mopologetics is science fiction. Orson Scott Card is in the right profession.


Waaaaay out in the ether.

[_malkie]

Only ever so slightly...

Steel - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steel
Steel is an alloy that consists mostly of iron and has a carbon content between 0.2% and 2.1% by weight, depending on the grade. Carbon is the most common ...

Even if it wasn't steel, but a loan-shift word, the bigger problem is the description of smelting among the Jaredites and the Nephites, for which there is no evidence.

In that case would it not be inaccurate to say that "steel" was confirmed - rather than to say that something that was translated as steel was confirmed, and that steel per se was unconfirmed?

[_Runtu]

In that case would it not be inaccurate to say that "steel" was confirmed - rather than to say that something that was translated as steel was confirmed, and that steel per se was unconfirmed?

Yep. It has smelted metals used to make swords. So, it would have to be a hard metal, such as iron or steel. The Mesoamericans did not have smelting technology, much less steel or iron swords.

[_ldsfaqs]

In that case would it not be inaccurate to say that "steel" was confirmed - rather than to say that something that was translated as steel was confirmed, and that steel per se was unconfirmed?

Yep. It has smelted metals used to make swords. So, it would have to be a hard metal, such as iron or steel. The Mesoamericans did not have smelting technology, much less steel or iron swords.

Liar liar pants on fire.....

http://maxwellinstitute.BYU.edu/publica ... cat_id=292

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metallurgy ... esoamerica

http://www.bmaf.org/node/164

http://en.fairmormon.org/Book_of_Mormon ... sms/Metals

[_Runtu]

Liar liar pants on fire.....

http://maxwellinstitute.BYU.edu/publica ... cat_id=292

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metallurgy ... esoamerica

http://www.bmaf.org/node/164

http://en.fairmormon.org/Book_of_Mormon ... sms/Metals

I absolutely stand by my statement that there was no smelting of hard metals during Book of Mormon times in the New World. Nothing you've posted contradicts that. You can call me all the names you want and post as many irrelevant links as you want. Your behavior reflects badly on you, not me.

[_DarkHelmet]

Liar liar pants on fire.....

http://maxwellinstitute.BYU.edu/publica ... cat_id=292

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metallurgy ... esoamerica

http://www.bmaf.org/node/164

http://en.fairmormon.org/Book_of_Mormon ... sms/Metals

I absolutely stand by my statement that there was no smelting of hard metals during Book of Mormon times in the New World. Nothing you've posted contradicts that. You can call me all the names you want and post as many irrelevant links as you want. Your behavior reflects badly on you, not me.

I seem to remember a few years ago some threads about Sorensen's claims. It seems all the apologists rely on Sorensen's work, and the sources he used to back up his claims were questionable at best. Does anyone have a link to that. I think Beastie did a lot of work debunking Sorensen.

[_DrW]

This Book of Mormon Claims Status Chart appeared again over on a MAD thread today.

The chart, however, is not the only entertainment to be had on this thread.

A critic (Mariner) quoted 2 Nephi 5:21 as proof the Book of Mormon teaches that the Lord really did put a curse on the Lamanites, a fact that it is now fashionable for Mormons to deny, I guess.

Anyway, I thought the following exchange was worth sharing.

Critic:

2 Nephi 5:21 And he had caused the cursing to come upon them, yea, even a sore cursing, because of their iniquity. For behold, they had hardened their hearts against him, that they had become like unto a flint; wherefore, as they were white, and exceedingly fair and delightsome, that they might not be enticing unto my people the Lord God did cause a skin of blackness to come upon them.

TBM response:

"I'm aware of what the bolded passage says. What it does not say is that this "skin of blackness" was the curse. All it says is that "the Lord God did cause a skin of blackness to come upon them" so that "they might not be enticing unto [Nephi's] people." It's a mark of the curse, but not the curse itself. As I have already shown you, the "curse" was that they would be separated from God as a result of their wickedness."

This TBM also had the following to say about the Lamanites.

“I agree with Joseph Smith that the modern American Indians are Lamanites; as I said before, all Native Americans are "Lamanites" because they are in some way related to Lehi, even if they are not.”

Nope, you just can't make this stuff up.

[_Runtu]

I seem to remember a few years ago some threads about Sorensen's claims. It seems all the apologists rely on Sorensen's work, and the sources he used to back up his claims were questionable at best. Does anyone have a link to that. I think Beastie did a lot of work debunking Sorensen.

http://mormonmesoamerica.com/metallurgy.htm

[_Brackite]

I love the Book of Abraham, because like the Book of Mormon, modern scholarship is only proving it true.

Fact is, Book of Mormon claims are only being confirmed by Science, not debunked as it should be if it's false.

You got to love Obiwan/ldsfaqs.

[_Buffalo]

Nope, you just can't make this stuff up.

Book of Mormon: God cursed them and made their skin turn black
Mopologist: It doesn't say anything about God cursed them and made their skin turn black!!