From My Informant: Stormy Weather Ahead for Brant Gardner?

[_Kishkumen]

The idea the the mixing of religion and politics in LDS culture does not represent a form of ideology is risible. How idiotic, Droopy.

[_Carton]

How are things going for you these days, by the way? Did you wind up getting hired at BYU?

This is my final semester teaching at BYU. It's been a great experience. I loved the students, but I'm moving in a different direction.

Best,

--DB

I've been thinking about this the past few days. I also have emailed with a few other people who are interested in Bible studies. Just amateurs like me. But especially interested in Bible studies in terms of how they relate to Joseph Smith's reworking of the Bible in his "restored scripture". Some of us have read some of the stuff you've written. One of these people (a TBM acquaintance whose name many people would recognize) wrote the following in the context of our email discussion about you leaving BYU (he has permitted me to quote him anonymously here):

I was very much looking forward to David Bokovoy joining his considerable training and talents to the BYU Religion Department. I had hoped he would become one of the leaders of the department in the near future, and that first rate scholarship would be the hallmark of the department going forward. Regrettably, it now appears that first rate scholarship and a commitment to knowledge of "things as they really are" and "things as they really have been" is not truly a high priority for BYU and its religion department. This is a sad day for a university whose motto affirms that "the glory of God is intelligence."

Although I have become agnostic about religion as I have grown older, and I was never a BYU fan to begin with, I still understand and agree with the sentiments of this acquaintance. He can't understand why BYU is not falling all over itself offering you everything you might want to lead their religion department out of the dark ages (my words, not his). I told him that it doesn't really surprise me. But he doesn't understand it at all. How would you explain it to him if you had the chance?

[_Enuma Elish]

How would you explain it to him if you had the chance?

Thanks, Carton, for the support and kind words. There are some good people in Religious Education at BYU. They’ve recently hired my friend, Mesoamerican scholar Mark Wright. I would still be happy to have my own children attend the university.

For all of its strengths, however, BYU does not have a religious studies department; it has a religious education department. As such, BYU doesn’t teach and/or explore the types of issues that I have devoted considerable time and effort to acquire skills in.

So the fact that I am moving in a different direction is not so much a reflection on BYU, as it is me, and the choices that I have made throughout my life in terms of my education and professional interests.

In sum, I don’t have anything negative to say about BYU and/or Religious Ed. I love my alma mater, and I enjoyed teaching classes there.

I am sincerely grateful for the support though.

I will add that I absolutely agree with your approach to critical thinking, especially in terms of religious issues. I’m reading a wonderful book right now that I would highly recommend:

http://www.amazon.com/Evolving-Monkey-T ... 0310293995

Though very young, Evans has some profound religious insights on the evolution of faith and the importance of exploring with honestly our religious assumptions. I think you would enjoy it.

Best,

--DB

[_Enuma Elish]

Over the years, my focus has transcended more and more to areas of spiritually and social justice independent from and oftentimes antithetical to traditional "apologetics" in any form.

--DB

This is really inspiring. Sometimes I sense that I have witnessed a manifestation of the spirit and this is definitely one of those times. I love signs that there is hope for both the Church and the world.

Just following in your footsteps. Love you, Bro!

[_RockSlider]

Enuma Elish,

Godspeed.

[_Fence Sitter]

Thanks, Carton, for the support and kind words. There are some good people in Religious Education at BYU. They’ve recently hired my friend, Mesoamerican scholar Mark Wright. I would still be happy to have my own children attend the university.

For all of its strengths, however, BYU does not have a religious studies department; it has a religious education department. As such, BYU doesn’t teach and/or explore the types of issues that I have devoted considerable time and effort to acquire skills in.

So the fact that I am moving in a different direction is not so much a reflection on BYU, as it is me, and the choices that I have made throughout my life in terms of my education and professional interests.

In sum, I don’t have anything negative to say about BYU and/or Religious Ed. I love my alma mater, and I enjoyed teaching classes there.

I am sincerely grateful for the support though.

I will add that I absolutely agree with your approach to critical thinking, especially in terms of religious issues. I’m reading a wonderful book right now that I would highly recommend:

http://www.amazon.com/Evolving-Monkey-T ... 0310293995

Though very young, Evans has some profound religious insights on the evolution of faith and the importance of exploring with honestly our religious assumptions. I think you would enjoy it.

Best,

--DB

DB,

I always enjoy reading what you have to say.

I would suggest that the bolded part says something negative about BYU.

[_Yoda]

Thanks, Carton, for the support and kind words. There are some good people in Religious Education at BYU. They’ve recently hired my friend, Mesoamerican scholar Mark Wright. I would still be happy to have my own children attend the university.

For all of its strengths, however, BYU does not have a religious studies department; it has a religious education department. As such, BYU doesn’t teach and/or explore the types of issues that I have devoted considerable time and effort to acquire skills in.

So the fact that I am moving in a different direction is not so much a reflection on BYU, as it is me, and the choices that I have made throughout my life in terms of my education and professional interests.

In sum, I don’t have anything negative to say about BYU and/or Religious Ed. I love my alma mater, and I enjoyed teaching classes there.

I am sincerely grateful for the support though.

I will add that I absolutely agree with your approach to critical thinking, especially in terms of religious issues. I’m reading a wonderful book right now that I would highly recommend:

http://www.amazon.com/Evolving-Monkey-T ... 0310293995

Though very young, Evans has some profound religious insights on the evolution of faith and the importance of exploring with honestly our religious assumptions. I think you would enjoy it.

Best,

--DB

DB,

I always enjoy reading what you have to say.

I would suggest that the bolded part says something negative about BYU.

Agreed. That is a real shame.

Good luck with everything, David, and congrats on your Doctorate! I hope to have mine within the next two years. We'll see how it goes.

[_why me]

I also have absolutely no doubt that you have unresolved issues from high school that you are still taking out on the world.

Aren't we all. Of course, I also understand that you will never say this to an exmo or a postmo. And that is okay, I guess.

[_Droopy]

I'm glad to see Droopy has recovered from the full body cast I put him in in the Off-Topic thread. Luckily he was unemployed and thus missed no work.

You mean your resuscitation of long exploded and discarded leftist myths and ideological urban legends regarding the Vietnam war and the very unwholesome fact that the Left was, overwhelmingly, not only AWOL on the entire Cold War (with some exceptions), but cheering for the other side in the Vietnam conflict?

That wasn't a body cast you put me in Bond, but on a C-PAP machine. I was laughing so hard for the duration of that discussion that my lungs collapsed.

[Guest]

So, in other words, you're only on good terms with Schryver, and all the other apologists get embarrassed when you post, to the point of repeatedly banning you to get you to stop.

I've never been told, either publicly, or by PM or other means, that I am "embarrassing" to other apologists (except here, by people like you). Indeed, over the years, I've received a great deal of support and seconding of motions to a great deal that I've presented. The only people who I'm aware really don't like me, among the "apologetic" community at FAIR, are several moderators at the message board, and other "liberal" members of that community who may or may not be a part of LDS apologetics, depending upon what one takes that term to mean and in what context.

I've done a lot of PMing in my day. I know people online, have met a few of them, and I know who my friends are. I actually don't know who "Ares" and "Hestia" and the rest are, but they've made it clear that my "orthodox" positions on certain core issues, as well as my political philosophy, are not welcome at FAIR.

Cry me a river...