How did the LDS membership department get it so wrong?

[Guest]

I'm chasing US congregation numbers for 2009

Got it!!

2004 12,463
2005 12,753
2006 13,010
2007 13,201
2008 13,363
2009 13,475
2010 13,601
2011 13,628

[_Runtu]

I'm chasing US congregation numbers for 2009

2004 12,463
2005 12,753
2006 13,010
2007 13,201
2008 13,363
2009
2010 13,601
2011 13,628

The Salt Lake Tribune article I linked to above says the church acknowledges that the numbers were wrong and much too high.

[_Drifting]

I'm chasing US congregation numbers for 2009

2004 12,463
2005 12,753
2006 13,010
2007 13,201
2008 13,363
2009
2010 13,601
2011 13,628

A fair assumption might be 13,500...

[_Buffalo]

40% activity in the US? Sounds about right. And of course, much, much lower abroad.

[_Drifting]

40% activity in the US? Sounds about right. And of course, much, much lower abroad.

If all the members in the UK were active there would be an average of 566 people per congregation. (188,000 claimed members, 332 congregations). The actual average is less than 100.

Most congregations average below 100 attendee's each week.
Stake Conference (for 8 congregations) recently got less than 800 people attending. That's 3,700 less (based on assumed average) than should have been there.

[_Buffalo]

http://www.census.gov/compendia/statab/ ... 2s0076.pdf
http://www.census.gov/compendia/statab/ ... 2s0075.pdf

Members of record in the US: 6,058,907
People who self-identify as Mormon: 3,158,000

So, 40% activity rate per the SL Trib article, and only 16% of inactive Mormons still consider themselves Mormon. Approximately 50% of all American Members of record no longer consider themselves Mormon.

[_Runtu]

If all the members in the UK were active there would be an average of 566 people per congregation. (188,000 claimed members, 332 congregations). The actual average is less than 100.

Most congregations average below 100 attendee's each week.
Stake Conference (for 8 congregations) recently got less than 800 people attending. That's 3,700 less (based on assumed average) than should have been there.

Activity rates in Bolivia are somewhere between 10% and 20%. The church does a terrible job of retaining members.

[_Shulem]

Activity rates in Bolivia are somewhere between 10% and 20%. The church does a terrible job of retaining members.

I think you have it turned around, Runtu. It's the Bolivians that do a terrible job retaining the church! They must be a highly favored people of the lord. I think also the church is dying off the vine in Europe. The American church isn't wanted there.



Paul O

[_hatersinmyward]

It's probably an embarrassment for many to have their names taken off the records, I'd imagine even more so abroad.

Many people won't admit to being suckered in general, let alone admit to being suckered into Mormonism.

[_Drifting]

The church submitted to the survey an entirely new number for their year 2000 membership. This number is different AND LOWER than they publish in their own almanac. The reason this number is lower is that they removed about a million members who they say had no specific congregation affiliation at that time.

BUT, and this is the most important part.

WITHIN THE SAME DATASET, they used an entirely different method of accounting for the 2010 member numbers to include EVERYBODY who has ever been born or baptized into the faith -- including those who are not currently assigned to any congregation.

THIS IS A HUGE DECEPTION.

By artificially creating a lower starting number (A NUMBER THEY HAVE NEVER BEFORE PUBLISHED USING AN ACCOUNTING METHOD THEY DO NOT CURRENTLY USE AND HAVE NEVER USED BEFORE), the church gives the entirely false impression that they are growing at a faster rate.

If a national company used two entirely different accounting methods within the same report to give the appearance that their profits were double what they actually were, we'd be reading stories about investigations and indictments. It is a willing and very public attempt to falsify the data.

We all need to understand the evidence of desperation that this gives us. We're seeing into the soul of an organization coming to terms with its own very public death. There was likely a group of men sitting at a table facing the excruciating fact that if they submitted accurate numbers to this survey, it would show the world they have stopped growing. So they did what the church always does. They decided to change history and create a lie. Again.

They decided to use new numbers that conflicted with their own published numbers. Even though they had to know their lie would be quickly exposed, it was better than telling the truth. And they got the mileage from it that they wanted. At a time of unrivaled visibility around the world, headlines splashed that the Mormon church is once again the fastest growing religion. As Winston Churchill said, "A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on."