The Romney bullying story really bugs me

[_BartBurk]

How come this one gets to go here instead of in the off-topic area?

[_Rollo Tomasi]

He was a minor at the time --

It's being reported that Mitt was 18 years old at the time of the incident -- kids his age were fighting/dying in Vietnam at the same time Mitt was preying on this younger student.

[_Rollo Tomasi]

Which makes me question if we can believe the people (mostly Obama supporters) quoted in the article.

Most of those quoted were either eyewitnesses to or participants in the assault. What's not to believe? Even Mitt (who claimed not to remember the assault he led) seemed to admit he was guilty and was sorry.

And I understand the person supposedly involved is dead.

Yes, he died of liver cancer in 2004.

I never said Obama's behavior excused Mitt's, but if we're going to go back to what people did in high school we need to go back on Obama's too. Of course I never did anything in high school that I regret doing. Grade school, yes, high school, no.

We all did stupid things in high school, but what Mitt did seems WAY OVER the line. He organized and committed an assault on a younger, weaker, isolated, presumed-to-be-gay kid. Mitt should have been arrested for assault. This was not some "prank" or "hi-jinks" (words used by Mitt to describe his behavior in high school) -- this was a premeditated, cruel, vicious organized attack on a weak student. Mitt ought to be extremely ashamed and admit he did it. His "I don't remember" response cannot be believed (like much else he says).

[_Fifth Columnist]

Really his treatment of his dog says it all.

Did Romney treat his dog badly? In the 08 primaries, Romney's sons said they put the dog in a pet carrier on top of the car when they drove to New Hampshire because the dog loved it. McCain's supporters said it was horribly cruel to put the dog up in the wind like that for hours and hours.

This line of criticism was going along nicely until an avid motorcyclist pointed out that humans and dogs ride motorcycles (dogs usually in side cars) all the time at highway speeds without any adverse effects and the dogs like it.

This squares with my experience too. I grew up on a farm and we had a lot of dogs over the years. They all loved riding in the open air in the back of a truck most of the time with their face sticking out the side in the full blast of the air.

There were many times when we loaded the bed of the truck with hay so that the only place for the dog to ride was up on top fully exposed to the wind. Judging from the way they readily jumped up on top of the load, I have to say that they loved it. Even when we stopped, they would often stay up there until called down.

What does this mean? Romney's sons probably told the truth that their dog loved riding in the pet carrier on top of the car so that's where they put him.

[_BartBurk]

Which makes me question if we can believe the people (mostly Obama supporters) quoted in the article.

Most of those quoted were either eyewitnesses to or participants in the assault. What's not to believe? Even Mitt (who claimed not to remember the assault he led) seemed to admit he was guilty and was sorry.

And I understand the person supposedly involved is dead.

Yes, he died of liver cancer in 2004.

I never said Obama's behavior excused Mitt's, but if we're going to go back to what people did in high school we need to go back on Obama's too. Of course I never did anything in high school that I regret doing. Grade school, yes, high school, no.

We all did stupid things in high school, but what Mitt did seems WAY OVER the line. He organized and committed an assault on a younger, weaker, isolated, presumed-to-be-gay kid. Mitt should have been arrested for assault. This was not some "prank" or "hi-jinks" (words used by Mitt to describe his behavior in high school) -- this was a premeditated, cruel, vicious organized attack on a weak student. Mitt ought to be extremely ashamed and admit he did it. His "I don't remember" response cannot be believed (like much else he says).

How credible are the witnesses when they are admitted left wingers and one was a volunteer for the Obama campaign? It is hard for me to believe that one person quoted in the article actually admitted he never even heard about this incident until Washington Post told him about it. Seems to me that such an incident would be common knowledge among most of his classmates.

[_Rollo Tomasi]

How credible are the witnesses when they are admitted left wingers and one was a volunteer for the Obama campaign? It is hard for me to believe that one person quoted in the article actually admitted he never even heard about this incident until Washington Post told him about it. Seems to me that such an incident would be common knowledge among most of his classmates.

But there are several persons giving separate and consistent stories, some of whom were directly involved in the assault (others received hearsay reports). Those who admitted to participating in the assault had no motive to lie about the assault occurring, thereby sullying their own reputations. And Mitt didn't deny it. He claimed not to remember, but then he seemed to admit it might have occurred and that he was now sorry. If this is something Mitt never would have done, then he certainly would have flatly denied it, in my opinion.

[_DarkHelmet]

How credible are the witnesses when they are admitted left wingers and one was a volunteer for the Obama campaign? It is hard for me to believe that one person quoted in the article actually admitted he never even heard about this incident until Washington Post told him about it. Seems to me that such an incident would be common knowledge among most of his classmates.

Do you work for FARMS?

[_krose]

This fails the "shoe on the other foot" test quite badly. What if the story were reversed, and it was Obama who played barber for a gay kid when he was 18?

As a supporter of Obama's re-election, I readily admit that I would be looking for a way to explain the behavior, while at the same time being disappointed and discouraged by the revelation.

But can you imagine what kinds of things Burk, Droop and BC would be posting if that were the case? How loudly would Fox News and right-wing radio be shouting from the rooftops about this being clear evidence of the president's poor character? The "scary black man" talking point would be everywhere.

[_DrW]

He was a minor at the time --

It's being reported that Mitt was 18 years old at the time of the incident -- kids his age were fighting/dying in Vietnam at the same time Mitt was preying on this younger student.

This kind of bullying is bad behavior at age 16. At age 18, given that the victim was homosexual, it rises to the level of a hate crime. Were this to take place today involving 18 years olds, it would not be treated as a mere "prank".

I agree that this incident reveals a disturbing facet of Romney's overall worldview and his perception of himself.

[_RAJ]

This doesn't look good any way you slice it. It would be better if Romney just stepped up and apologized without the weaselly equivocation. As others have said, most of us did stupid things in our youth that we're not proud of --- whether through malice, insensitivity or ignorance. The thing to do is to acknowledge it, sincerely apologize, resolve to do better and move on.

On the subject of reaching that far back for incidents and stories that bear on a candidate's fitness and character; In the bio section of Romney's website, the heart-warming narrative we get is this:

http://www.mittromney.com/learn/mitt

Mitt married his wife, Ann, in 1969. They first met in elementary school when he was a Cub Scout; he remembers tossing pebbles at her when she rode by on a horse. When they met again years later at a friend’s house, he was smitten. Between them, they have five sons and sixteen grandchildren, who are the center of their lives.

All candidates do this, that's fine. Its just that if you're going to reach back and scoop out wonderful PR images with which to humanize your candidate, any concurrent snapshots that might not be so flattering become fair game.