If a perfect god created me...

[_madeleine]

We aren't gods. God is perfect by nature we are not. We are perfected, in and through Jesus Christ. The Christian concept of being perfect, tied very tightly if not completely to, loving perfectly. As God does.

When I said created perfect, I meant as God meant us to be...God called creation Good, in the beginning. The fall put us under what Jesus called, the "king of this world", whom He has defeated. Christ is King. The "job" of a Christian, is to act like this is understood! We fail, often quite miserably. God has not abandoned us in our sin. He has lifted us up.

[_Dantana]

The Christian concept of being perfect, tied very tightly if not completely to, loving perfectly. As God does.

From the wiki, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Love

Since the lust and attraction stages are both considered temporary, a third stage is needed to account for long-term relationships. Attachment is the bonding that promotes relationships lasting for many years and even decades. Attachment is generally based on commitments such as marriage and children, or on mutual friendship based on things like shared interests. It has been linked to higher levels of the chemicals oxytocin and vasopressin to a greater degree than short-term relationships have.[22] Enzo Emanuele and coworkers reported the protein molecule known as the nerve growth factor (NGF) has high levels when people first fall in love, but these return to previous levels after one year.[23

Love appears to be supplied by the body, and not the spirit, in a purely mechanical fashion. Even gods love is solely selfish.....it makes him feel good. Right?

[_moksha]

why am I in need of redemption? not perfect?

how does a perfect being create an imperfect me?

Because it is part of the story. A story that has generated a wonderful faith which provides comfort, solace and joy to two billion people. As the poet says, "do not ask what is it, let us go and make our visit". It is a worthwhile visit.

[_madeleine]

The Christian concept of being perfect, tied very tightly if not completely to, loving perfectly. As God does.

From the wiki, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Love

Since the lust and attraction stages are both considered temporary, a third stage is needed to account for long-term relationships. Attachment is the bonding that promotes relationships lasting for many years and even decades. Attachment is generally based on commitments such as marriage and children, or on mutual friendship based on things like shared interests. It has been linked to higher levels of the chemicals oxytocin and vasopressin to a greater degree than short-term relationships have.[22] Enzo Emanuele and coworkers reported the protein molecule known as the nerve growth factor (NGF) has high levels when people first fall in love, but these return to previous levels after one year.[23

Love appears to be supplied by the body, and not the spirit, in a purely mechanical fashion. Even gods love is solely selfish.....it makes him feel good. Right?

You lost me on your last sentence I think.

God created us with the ability to love. Christians have another word for God's love:charity. It can go down a deep theological discussion, that one. But it is late, and im tired. The kind of love we're called to is not based on love of one's self. we're called to love even when, if not especially when, it doesn't feel good at all.

God doesn't have to do anything for us. God is not dependent on emotion. God is not dependent on anything. God is love.

I've had a friend, who is much better at understanding this than I, i mean at the level of being. He tels me that I have to love even the most hardened criminal. It feels good to think on that. Love for everyone, no matter how terrible I perceive them to be. In practice though, that is not so easy. Sometimes there are people that are very difficult to love.

[_Nightlion]

D&C 93:21-34
21 And now, verily I say unto you, I was in the beginning with the Father, and am the Firstborn;
22 And all those who are begotten through me are partakers of the glory of the same, and are the church of the Firstborn.
23 Ye were also in the beginning with the Father; that which is Spirit, even the Spirit of truth;
24 And truth is knowledge of things as they are, and as they were, and as they are to come;
25 And whatsoever is more or less than this is the spirit of that wicked one who was a liar from the beginning.
26 The Spirit of truth is of God. I am the Spirit of truth, and John bore record of me, saying: He received a fulness of truth, yea, even of all truth;
27 And no man receiveth a fulness unless he keepeth his commandments.
28 He that keepeth his commandments receiveth truth and light, until he is glorified in truth and knoweth all things.
29 Man was also in the beginning with God. Intelligence, or the light of truth, was not created or made, neither indeed can be.
30 All truth is independent in that sphere in which God has placed it, to act for itself, as all intelligence also; otherwise there is no existence.
31 Behold, here is the agency of man, and here is the condemnation of man; because that which was from the beginning is plainly manifest unto them, and they receive not the light.
32 And every man whose spirit receiveth not the light is under condemnation.
33 For man is spirit. The elements are eternal, and spirit and element, inseparably connected, receive a fulness of joy;
34 And when separated, man cannot receive a fulness of joy.

That which is unique to become you was never created or made. And it cannot be made. God gave you the knowledge of an independent sphere of existence. How you choose to become with that ability to be independent is governed by that light and truth particle that you have always been.

We are annoyed at almost everything in his life. It is so from our first moment as a child, helpless and yet very needy. Our patience is forced to choose how to react. This causes us to enlarge our souls against this reality. If we reject truth, meaning that we invent a lie, we cannot be enlarged and must remain under condemnation.

If a child is unfortunately not loved and nurtured he might choose wildly a lie for his reality and in the panic of helplessness be inconsolable. Will they ever learn? Will FAITH come to them that they might peaceably possess their souls? All things are possible to them that believe. Those who resist the truth must invent an alternate reality of lies.

Babies who do not die must be getting enough evidence to have faith. Try not to die. Believe.

[_Nightlion]

Aw come on Socks. I deserve a response for having confounded you utterly. Why do you bring up these things if you have no interest in the truth?

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

So. Uh. God isn't the Devil? Who was Perfect and who allowed Evil to exist?

- VRDRC

[_Nightlion]

So. Uh. God isn't the Devil? Who was Perfect and who allowed Evil to exist?

- VRDRC

I suppose you are asking me. Of course you do not care one way or the other. You will continue to slam God regardless. But for my many silent friends out there let me put up an answer.

Evil begins to exist the moment intelligence is let loose in independent spheres of existence. See the scripture quoted above in D&C 93. What caused Satan to rebel in the proto-beginning? I say proto because Mormons are unfamiliar with their own scripture and fail to read and realize that the organization of intelligence preceded what they are familiar with as the spirit body birth to heavenly parents. Ahem, well, Satan did rebel because he did not want to submit to Jesus Christ who was his Maker and God, even the Very Eternal Father and not his brother. Putzes! Because the plan required certain things evil popped up and said NO!

Moses 5:9-13
9 And in that day the Holy Ghost fell upon Adam, which beareth record of the Father and the Son, saying: I am the Only Begotten of the Father from the beginning, henceforth and forever, that as thou hast fallen thou mayest be redeemed, and all mankind, even as many as will.
10 And in that day Adam blessed God and was filled, and began to prophesy concerning all the families of the earth, saying: Blessed be the name of God, for because of my transgression my eyes are opened, and in this life I shall have ejoy, and again in the flesh I shall see God.
11 And Eve, his wife, heard all these things and was glad, saying: Were it not for our transgression we never should have had seed, and never should have known good and evil, and the joy of our redemption, and the eternal life which God giveth unto all the obedient.
12 And Adam and Eve blessed the name of God, and they made all things known unto their sons and their daughters.
13 And Satan came among them, saying: I am also a son of God; and he commanded them, saying:Believe it not; and they believed it not, and they loved Satan more than God. And men began from that time forth to be carnal, sensual, and devilish.

When God forgave all in the original guilt (see below) of the fall and were thereby innocent Satan came among them saying that he also was a son of God and told them to not believe what Adam and Eve was teaching, which was the gospel of Jesus Christ......yeah, Adam and Eve were the world's first Christians.

Evil is to go contrary to the commandments of God. God commanded that we love one another. Starving children and abused children are not God's doing but the breaking of his commandments. Putzes!

Evil exists because independent intelligence is free to chose it. End of Story. Nighty-knight.

Moses 6:53-64
53 And our father Adam spake unto the Lord, and said: Why is it that men must repent and be baptized in water? And the Lord said unto Adam: Behold I have forgiven thee thy transgression in the Garden of Eden.
54 Hence came the saying abroad among the people, that the Son of God hath atoned for original guilt, wherein the sins of the parents cannot be answered upon the heads of the children, for they are whole from the foundation of the world.
55 And the Lord spake unto Adam, saying: Inasmuch as thy children are conceived in sin, even so when they begin to grow up, sin conceiveth in their hearts, and they taste the bitter, that they may know to prize the good.
56 And it is given unto them to know good from evil; wherefore they are agents unto themselves, and I have given unto you another law and commandment.
57 Wherefore teach it unto your children, that all men, everywhere, must repent, or they can in nowise inherit the kingdom of God, for no unclean thing can dwell there, or dwell in his presence; for, in the language of Adam, Man of Holiness is his name, and the name of his Only Begotten is the Son of Man, even Jesus Christ, a righteous Judge, who shall come in the meridian of time.
58 Therefore I give unto you a commandment, to teach these things freely unto your children, saying:
59 That by reason of transgression cometh the fall, which fall bringeth death, and inasmuch as ye were born into the world by water, and blood, and the spirit, which I have made, and so became of dust a living soul, even so ye must be born again into the kingdom of heaven, of water, and of the Spirit, and be cleansed by blood, even the blood of mine Only Begotten; that ye might be sanctified from all sin, and enjoy the words of eternal life in this world, and eternal life in the world to come, even immortal glory;
60 For by the water ye keep the commandment; by the Spirit ye are justified, and by the blood ye are sanctified;
61 Therefore it is given to abide in you; the record of heaven; the Comforter; the peaceable things of immortal glory; the truth of all things; that which quickeneth all things, which maketh alive all things; that which knoweth all things, and hath all power according to wisdom, mercy, truth, justice, and judgment.
62 And now, behold, I say unto you: This is the plan of salvation unto all men, through the blood of mine Only Begotten, who shall come in the meridian of time.

It is not Adam's fault that there is sin in the world. God forgave him and children are born innocent. So evil conceives in their own heart, meaning intelligence invents evil anew on an individual basis. Each an agent unto themselves. We invent and originate all evil. Putzes!

Now don't you want to repent and get power over that evil in ya? You could, if you only wanted to.