"don't embarrass yourself by asking about metallurgy..."

[_Shulem]

Having the Gold plates in a museum somewhere would not cause people to believe in Mormonism. That requires faith in God. It would make little to no difference (and would in fact be couter productive) in people's faith. The reason it would be counter productive is that people would instead believe the party line taught by men instead of seeking and speaking with God, which is what God is after.

Stop it and sit down and listen!

If the golden plates were in a museum and science was able to decipher the language much like the Rosetta Stone using the existing Book of Mormon in print there would be no question that golden plates really do exist and shown to be ancient. That would be established fact. And the stories and information in the Book of Mormon would give creedence to Joseph Smith and the very prophecies about HIM in the Book of Mormon -- thus lending to the fact that someone knew about things to come and they were verified.

In this instance -- no one could deny the existence of the plates and the marvelous claims found in the story.

In the same vein, there are people who claimed to have seen the resurrected Christ and that of course is not based on faith but seeing is believing. Regardless, the business of Christ being resurrected and the golden plates is a hoax for people that need to have faith in something because they can't seem to order their own lives in happiness apart from needing a Jesus to help them. And speaking with God in prayer is all in your mind. It's faith and well wishes. You don;t know what you're talking too -- perhaps just yourself or a shadow of nice things and thoughts.

There.

Paul O

[_Shulem]

Or maybe I understand what to base real faith on, as do other Mormons. This is the true basis of Mormonism and why those who are the opponents of Mormonism will never prevail because it is based on God.

Show me your rock solid evidence, Tobin. Prove to me you have evidence in which your faith is built and then explain how you have faith in things not seen while you're looking at it.

Your statement is totally wrongminded:

"I said have rock solid evidence of God and use that as the basis of your faith."

Paul O

[_Tobin]

Having the Gold plates in a museum somewhere would not cause people to believe in Mormonism. That requires faith in God. It would make little to no difference (and would in fact be couter productive) in people's faith. The reason it would be counter productive is that people would instead believe the party line taught by men instead of seeking and speaking with God, which is what God is after.

Stop it and sit down and listen!

If the golden plates were in a museum and science was able to decipher the language much like the Rosetta Stone using the existing Book of Mormon in print there would be no question that golden plates really do exist and shown to be ancient. That would be established fact. And the stories and information in the Book of Mormon would give creedence to Joseph Smith and the very prophecies about HIM in the Book of Mormon -- thus lending to the fact that someone knew about things to come and they were verified.

In this instance -- no one could deny the existence of the plates and the marvelous claims found in the story.

In the same vein, there are people who claimed to have seen the resurrected Christ and that of course is not based on faith but seeing is believing. Regardless, the business of Christ being resurrected and the golden plates is a hoax for people that need to have faith in something because they can't seem to order their own lives in happiness apart from needing a Jesus to help them. And speaking with God in prayer is all in your mind. It's faith and well wishes. You don;t know what you're talking too -- perhaps just yourself or a shadow of nice things and thoughts.

There.

Paul O

You are wrong. It would create a cult around the plates and those who claimed the authentic right to interpret those plates would be given power they should not. This would be a distraction from God and faith in him instead. This was not God's intention otherwise Mormons would still possess the plates. This type of proof is not how God operates since it only engenders faith in signs, artifacts, and those who possess such things.

[_Tobin]

Or maybe I understand what to base real faith on, as do other Mormons. This is the true basis of Mormonism and why those who are the opponents of Mormonism will never prevail because it is based on God.

Show me your rock solid evidence, Tobin. Prove to me you have evidence in which your faith is built and then explain how you have faith in things not seen while you're looking at it.

Your statement is totally wrongminded:

"I said have rock solid evidence of God and use that as the basis of your faith."

Paul O

I have already explained that statement below.

[_Mad Viking]

Having the Gold plates in a museum somewhere would not cause people to believe in Mormonism. That requires faith in God. It would make little to no difference (and would in fact be couter productive) in people's faith. The reason it would be counter productive is that people would instead believe the party line taught by men instead of seeking and speaking with God, which is what God is after.

I've never understood the purpose that faith ultimately plays in God's plan. Can you help me out?

[_Drifting]

Having the Gold plates in a museum somewhere would not cause people to believe in Mormonism. That requires faith in God. It would make little to no difference (and would in fact be couter productive) in people's faith. The reason it would be counter productive is that people would instead believe the party line taught by men instead of seeking and speaking with God, which is what God is after.

I've never understood the purpose that faith ultimately plays in God's plan. Can you help me out?

No Tobin, it may not.
However it would cause people to believe that Joseph had Gold Plates with inscriptions on them which could subsequently be checked.
Now I know that didn't work out so well on the whole Book of Abraham thing but that doesn't mean to say the Gold Plates would not have fared better under wider impartial scrutiny.

Just think how faith promoting it would be for the leaders to be able to show the world the actual Gold Plates. You know like Holland did with Hyrum's Book of Mormon....okay, bad example...

[_Drifting]

Having the Gold plates in a museum somewhere would not cause people to believe in Mormonism. That requires faith in God. It would make little to no difference (and would in fact be couter productive) in people's faith. The reason it would be counter productive is that people would instead believe the party line taught by men instead of seeking and speaking with God, which is what God is after.

I've never understood the purpose that faith ultimately plays in God's plan. Can you help me out?

Faith is Gods way of compensating for incompetent leaders.

[_Buffalo]

Having the Gold plates in a museum somewhere would not cause people to believe in Mormonism. That requires faith in God. It would make little to no difference (and would in fact be couter productive) in people's faith. The reason it would be counter productive is that people would instead believe the party line taught by men instead of seeking and speaking with God, which is what God is after.

I've never understood the purpose that faith ultimately plays in God's plan. Can you help me out?

It's an ad hoc solution. Any belief system that has no evidence for its beliefs must necessarily turn belief without evidence into a cherished value. Hence, the notion of "faith." Faith only came to be seen as a positive trait among believers because there is no evidence for their beliefs.

[Guest]

You are wrong. It would create a cult around the plates and those who claimed the authentic right to interpret those plates would be given power they should not. This would be a distraction from God and faith in him instead. This was not God's intention otherwise Mormons would still possess the plates. This type of proof is not how God operates since it only engenders faith in signs, artifacts, and those who possess such things.

I'm wrong? If the plates existed and contained the actual story of the Book of Mormon I'd be happy to say that the plates exist because it was PROVEN. So I'm right, not wrong.

You say that God exists but he isn't in the museum for everyone to see and examine. He's in your mind and in the minds of others. All you have is your faith and that doesn't do a damn thing for me. Your evidence is like the Explanations of Facsimile No. 3 which can never be proven true. Your Jesus is like the missing evidence at Cumorah. It doesn't exist. I reject Jesus! The Christian religion and moreover Mormonism is a sham.

You may have your Joe Smith! Go marry him for all I care. He was a dirty rat and a liar. Facsimile No. 3 is PROOF of that. The world knows it and weighs the facts in truth but brainwashed Mormons are walking around like retarded people who drink too much. Mormons are spiritual drunks. They are hazardous to society and are hell bent on printing lies (Facsimile No. 3).

Mormons are not to be trusted. They are not honest people.

Paul O

[_Tobin]

You are wrong. It would create a cult around the plates and those who claimed the authentic right to interpret those plates would be given power they should not. This would be a distraction from God and faith in him instead. This was not God's intention otherwise Mormons would still possess the plates. This type of proof is not how God operates since it only engenders faith in signs, artifacts, and those who possess such things.

I'm wrong? If the plates existed and contained the actual story of the Book of Mormon I'd be happy to say that the plates exist because it was PROVEN. So I'm right, not wrong.

You say that God exists but he isn't in the museum for everyone to see and examine. He's in your mind and in the minds of others. All you have is your faith and that doesn't do a damn thing for me. Your evidence is like the Explanations of Facsimile No. 3 which can never be proven true. Your Jesus is like the missing evidence at Cumorah. It doesn't exist. I reject Jesus! The Christian religion and moreover Mormonism is a sham.

You may have your Joe Smith! Go marry him for all I care. He was a dirty rat and a liar. Facsimile No. 3 is PROOF of that. The world knows it and weighs the facts in truth but brainwashed Mormons are walking around like r******* people who drink too much. Mormons are spiritual drunks. The are hazardous to society and are hell bent on printing lies (Facsimile No. 3).

Mormons are not to be trusted. They are not honest people.

Paul O

I'm not going to get into pedantic discussion with you about Facsimile No. 3 as you already know my position. And the knowledge of whether or not the gold plates existed is of little value if you don't believe their contents, so why create a spectacle? The reason they were created was for their content and to lead people to God and experiencing God. Whether or not you choose to follow the Lord and do what he asks is up to you.