lulu wrote:There are at least 150 denominations claiming to follow Joseph Smith. So I guess you're right, it's not a movement.
Lulu, do you disagree with what my dictionary said about what Mormonism actually is?
If you want to call yourself a member of one of the "at least 150 denominations claiming to follow Joseph Smith," you certainly have a right to call yourself that. But if you call yourself part of Mormonism, my dictionary says you're tying yourself to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
lulu wrote:There are at least 150 denominations claiming to follow Joseph Smith. So I guess you're right, it's not a movement.
Lulu, do you disagree with what my dictionary said about what Mormonism actually is?
If you want to call yourself a member of one of the "at least 150 denominations claiming to follow Joseph Smith," you certainly have a right to call yourself that. But if you call yourself part of Mormonism, my dictionary says you're tying yourself to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
Why my dear Kevin, I would never disagree with your dictionary. I'm sure its the final authority on all things ontological, epistomological and definitional.
"And the human knew the source of life, the woman of him, and she conceived and bore Cain, and said, 'I have procreated a man with Yahweh.'" Gen. 4:1, interior quote translated by D. Bokovoy.
Thews wrote:Translation... can someone, anyone, please jump in a take my back because you like me? I realize I'm a pathetic false witness who pretends to believe in Joseph Smith and package lies to make the itching ears believe in the truth claims of Joseph Smith under the banner of Christianity, but I don't care about the real word of Jesus Christ. What I care about is me, so please help me... please... just post something to show support... I need it.]
Translation--My name is Thews. I don't have the balls to answer the questions posed my way so I have to resort to personal attacks. I am such a big man.
by the way, Thews, here is a present from Jersey Girl:
Who gives a rat's ass about Jersey Girl? You? You're nothing more than a plastic fake who buys into the Mormon game because your husband has horny Joe's blood flowing through him. You are a sickening testament to women, throwing the children Joseph Smith screwed under the bus along with Jesus Christ as "tempting" him. Go ahead and sell your snake oil... there will be those that back you. Here's something I know you can't and will not do. This is my testimony from my soul:
I swear by the God I believe in as Jesus Christ that every single word ever said by Joseph Smith was that of a false prophet of God. I swear by the God I believe in as Jesus Christ that my witness is the from the depth of my soul. I say these things, in the name of Jesus Christ, amen.
Your turn Liz... time for you to run away, or pony up and give us your testimony. I'm calling you a liar, but if you swear in the name of Jesus Christ, I will apologize and be sincere about it.
Last edited by Guest on Thu May 31, 2012 3:57 am, edited 3 times in total.
2 Tim 4:3 For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. 2 Tim 4:4 They will turn their ears away from the truth & turn aside to myths
Say something intelligent and I'll answer you lulu. This plastic backing of Liz is transparent.
2 Tim 4:3 For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. 2 Tim 4:4 They will turn their ears away from the truth & turn aside to myths
Say something intelligent and I'll answer you lulu. This plastic backing of Liz is transparent.
Back smack, thews. If you don't have the balls to answer, just say the question wasn't intelligent.
Has anyone ever seen Droopy and thews in the same room together?
"And the human knew the source of life, the woman of him, and she conceived and bore Cain, and said, 'I have procreated a man with Yahweh.'" Gen. 4:1, interior quote translated by D. Bokovoy.
lulu wrote:Back smack, thews. If you don't have the balls to answer, just say the question wasn't intelligent.
Has anyone ever seen Droopy and thews in the same room together?
Answer what lulu? Does clucking along with Liz make you feel like a man? Or are you a woman? Just how far do you have to go to speak for Liz so she doesn't have to?
2 Tim 4:3 For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. 2 Tim 4:4 They will turn their ears away from the truth & turn aside to myths
Drifting wrote:The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints is the organization. Mormonism is the movemement.
I don't usually get involved in terminology debates, but I think in this case I'm going to make an exception. How in the world did you come to the conclusion that Mormonism is a movement?
I looked up Mormonism in Webster's New World College Dictionary (published by MacMillan), and it defines the noun Mormon as "a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (commonly called the Mormon Church), founded in the U.S. in 1830 by Joseph Smith: its sacred Book of Mormon was represented by Smith as his translation of an account of some ancient American peoples by a prophet among them named Mormon," and the adjective Mormon as "of the Mormons or their religion." Those two definitions are followed by: "--Mormonism n."
So from there I looked up -ism and got seven definitions, the fourth of which seemed to fit best: "the doctrine, school, theory, or principle of." So it's pretty clear to me that the definition of Mormonism is the doctrine, school, theory, or principle of the Mormon Church, which is a common name of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. If you want to call it a movement you certainly may, but it looks to me like the dictionary clearly states that such a movement is inseparably connected to the LDS Church (much more than Christianity is tied to any Christian church), and therefore the leaders of the LDS Church have the perfect right to decide who is part of Mormonism and who is not.
The term "Mormon" predates the split into several different sects. While the Brighamite sect, which maintained the title The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, is by far the largest, and the organization most often referred to with the term "Mormon," I see no reason to deny those other groups that are also offshoots of Smith's original church the right to call themselves Mormons as well. Most use the Book of Mormon and still hold to the prophetic calling of Joseph Smith, after all.
lulu wrote:Back smack, thews. If you don't have the balls to answer, just say the question wasn't intelligent.
Has anyone ever seen Droopy and thews in the same room together?
Answer what lulu? Does clucking along with Liz make you feel like a man? Or are you a woman? Just how far do you have to go to speak for Liz so she doesn't have to?
I'm in touch with both my femine and masculine sides. "Answer what?" I posted a long historiographical piece on Christian theology. Oh, wait, I posted it twice. Once especially for you. If you can't find what you are to respond to, you can't find your balls with both hands.
"And the human knew the source of life, the woman of him, and she conceived and bore Cain, and said, 'I have procreated a man with Yahweh.'" Gen. 4:1, interior quote translated by D. Bokovoy.
I will attempt to answer your question and I trust that if Thews disagrees with my response he will let us know.
The fact that many Christian churches have existed over the centuries does not in any way militate against the notion that the Mystical Body of Christ (a.k.a. the Church) is unitary. This indeed was the purpose of the early Councils, to set the bounds of the Church as being precisely unitary (or "One") as well as "Holy," "Universal" (== katholikos or "Catholic") and "Apostolic."
To reject the authority of the first Councils is by definition to position oneself outside of the Mystical Body of Christ. Mormons are not Christian because they believe that the bishops present at those Councils were apostates. I admit that the situation is somewhat more complicated when you consider pre-Conciliar Gnostic and/or Hermetic Christianities (plural), but the dividing line is and always has been the Nicene Creed.
I will attempt to answer your question and I trust that if Thews disagrees with my response he will let us know.
The fact that many Christian churches have existed over the centuries does not in any way militate against the notion that the Mystical Body of Christ (a.k.a. the Church) is unitary. This indeed was the purpose of the early Councils, to set the bounds of the Church as being precisely unitary (or "One") as well as "Holy," "Universal" (== katholikos or "Catholic") and "Apostolic."
To reject the authority of the first Councils is by definition to position oneself outside of the Mystical Body of Christ. Mormons are not Christian because they believe that the bishops present at those Councils were apostates. I admit that the situation is somewhat more complicated when you consider pre-Conciliar Gnostic and/or Hermetic Christianities (plural), but the dividing line is and always has been the Nicene Creed.
So is this why Gnostics are considered heretical, yet still Christian, but Mormons are considered non-Christian?
