All socialists stand and be accounted for

[_ajax18]

Congratulations Quasi. I have nothing but respect for those who can find a way to have to their own business. In a perfect world nobody would ever lose the independence provided by being small farmers.

[_ajax18]

How much help could be given to the poor if we hadn't went to war in Afghanistan and Iraq (and Vietnam...and aid to right wing dictators in South America...and etc and military bases in Germany and Japan on and so forth)?

Admittedly I don't understand the war situation completely either. But that doesn't make what Michelle Obama is doing any more noble.

[_Quasimodo]

Congratulations Quasi. I have nothing but respect for those who can find a way to have to their own business. In a perfect world nobody would ever lose the independence provided by being small farmers.

Funny you should say that. I've often thought that the smartest person in the world lives on a small farm out in the country somewhere and no one knows that he (or she) is the smartest person in the world.

Don't reject the idea that you can have your own business, too. It just takes coming up with the right plan.

[_Bond James Bond]

How much help could be given to the poor if we hadn't went to war in Afghanistan and Iraq (and Vietnam...and aid to right wing dictators in South America...and etc and military bases in Germany and Japan on and so forth)?

Admittedly I don't understand the war situation completely either. But that doesn't make what Michelle Obama is doing any more noble.

I'm sure I can dig up vacations taken by Laura Bush on the govt dime. The point is that the govt spending I disagree with is much more than a few Obama vacations so I win the game of "who hates govt spending I disagree with the most".

[_ajax18]

I'm sure I can dig up vacations taken by Laura Bush on the govt dime.

And that wouldn't make it right either would it.

[_Kevin Graham]

Each one of those vacations cost at least $450k and that's only the expenses that they were willing to reveal.

Ajax you don't know what the hell you are talking about. The one vacation that was criticized because it cost $450k was a trip to Spain(you say all their vacations cost at least that amount which is nonsense) and that figure was based on estimates from, according to FOX News, "a conservative watchdog group that obtained Secret Service records from the overseas excursion." So we're essentially just trusting what these folks say, since you haven't seen these documents yourself. In any event, this amazing news story goes on to say, "Secret Service costs totaled nearly $255,000, according to Judicial Watch. Based on Pentagon estimates of flight costs, another $199,000 went toward the flight from the United States to Mallorca and back." That's practically the entire amount you're whining about.

So how is this a waste of US taxdollars when what you're talking about is the purchase of services in our beloved free market? Services were paid for with the secret service, the airline, jet fuel company, etc. etc. The money went straight back into the economy.

With regards to personal expenses, the same story goes on to say, "the White House described the vacation as a private trip and said the first lady and others would be paying their own expenses."

Ah, so the penny drops. It was a private trip. Everyone paid for their own personal expenses once they arrived. And from what I understand, the secret service gets paid on salary, not according to the trips they have to take. This "watchdog" organization probably took their annual salaries and prorated them to determine what they were getting paid for that week. But what they don't tell you is that these men were going to get that money anyway, so it wouldn't really matter if they were protecting the First Lady in Spain or while she was walking the streets of Chicago. The amount spent on secret service is roughly the same, and it isn't cheap. But what would you have them do, abandon the practice of protecting the First Family, just so one of your cousins can take a shot at them?

You make it sound like Obama's family is blowing hundreds of thousands of tax dollars for their personal use, when the fact is they were millionaires before they became public figures and taking vacations with children is the norm for people with their income. George Bush spent considerably more of the taxpayer money on trips to Texas, by the way. His Father was playing golf as bombs were dropping in Iraq.

[_krose]

How much help could be given to the poor if we hadn't [gone] to war in Afghanistan and Iraq...

You silly sod. Why should we be concerned about a few trillion dollars spent on wars of choice, when we can complain about an uppity black woman's vacation expenses?

For the number impaired, that's kind of a lot of money. If I won a million dollars in a lottery every single day, after a thousand days (nearly three years) I would have a billion dollars.

To get to one trillion, I would have to win the million-dollar lottery every day for 2,700 years. So after about 10,000 years of winning $1 million per day, I would finally have enough to pay for Iraq and Afghanistan.

[_MeDotOrg]

I'm just curious how many of you guys are socialists?

Well, since we're all communicating on the Internet, and the internet was developed by the government, I suppose we all are.

[_moksha]

I always understood socialism to mean the government taking earnings from one worker's paycheck and giving that money to those that the elected government officials viewed as more in need of the funds.

This would fit the Sheriff of Nottingham to a tee. He will of course give the money to King John for use in bringing his brother, the "so called" crusader, back home. See you back in the forest, but please leave those claymores behind. They belong in the 20th Century.