Chap wrote:Rulers of antiquity often kept harems with large numbers of women in them, subjected vast numbers of people to slavery, forced migration and dispossession, and exterminated whole populations as part of military activity. So that makes it OK for someone in the 19th century to do the same? Neat.
I hope that every truly objective reader here can clearly see to what degree the enemies of the restored church are willing to go to distort the truth!!!
Chaps, are you trying to infer that The saints promoted exterminations, slavery, and had harems, and forced migrations?!? Perhaps, you need to look up the definitions of all these terms so that you can use the proper terms so that some intelligent person may take you more seriously in the future!!!!!!!
Thews, the same goes for you! Here's your example:
"We believe in the same organization that existed in the primitive church, namely; apostles, prophets, pastors, teachers, evangelists, and so forth."
It's called the 6th article of faith for the church of Jesus Christ of latter-day saints, Thews! Do you know of another church that has all these?!?!?!?
gdemetz wrote: "We believe in the same organization that existed in the primitive church, namely; apostles, prophets, pastors, teachers, evangelists, and so forth."
It's called the 6th article of faith for the church of Jesus Christ of latter-day saints, Thews! Do you know of another church that has all these?!?!?!?
I attended Church on Sunday but didn't see any pastors, the teachers were 14 years old and there were no serving evangelists. So even the Mormon Church doesn't have these.
“We look to not only the spiritual but also the temporal, and we believe that a person who is impoverished temporally cannot blossom spiritually.” Keith McMullin - Counsellor in Presiding Bishopric
"One, two, three...let's go shopping!" Thomas S Monson - Prophet, Seer, Revelator
gdemetz wrote:Pastors are those presiding, evangelists are the patriarchs, and what difference does it make how old the teachers were/are?!?
So the Deacons Quorum President is a pastor? Why doesn't the Article Of Faith state 'Patriarch' or why aren't Patriarch's called 'Evangalists'? Show me the position of Teacher as written about in the Bible.
“We look to not only the spiritual but also the temporal, and we believe that a person who is impoverished temporally cannot blossom spiritually.” Keith McMullin - Counsellor in Presiding Bishopric
"One, two, three...let's go shopping!" Thomas S Monson - Prophet, Seer, Revelator
Both quite clearly referring to those who teach rather than the title of an office within a priesthood. Using the patriarch (even as some kind of fortune teller) is quite outside the definition of the word never mind a complete misinterpretation of the word evangelist.
Hello Albion?! The New Testament is a translation from the Greek! It was translated by the KJ translators as an evangelist, but the office functioned was similar to what is now termed a patriarch but it is OK if you want to call them evangelists, but don't confuse that with the the dummies who make the alter calls! Albion, I have already shot you down on that one, and you have the nerve to bring it up again?!? Do you also think that Bishop Timothy, who received his priesthood by the laying on of hands was nothing more than a teacher?!?
gdemetz wrote:Hello Albion?! The New Testament is a translation from the Greek! It was translated by the KJ translators as an evangelist, but the office functioned was similar to what is now termed a patriarch but it is OK if you want to call them evangelists, but don't confuse that with the the dummies who make the alter calls! Albion, I have already shot you down on that one, and you have the nerve to bring it up again?!? Do you also think that Bishop Timothy, who received his priesthood by the laying on of hands was nothing more than a teacher?!?
List the Priesthood offices mentioned in the Bible (with scriptural references obviously) and put alongside them the equivalent Priesthood office in today's Mormonism.
“We look to not only the spiritual but also the temporal, and we believe that a person who is impoverished temporally cannot blossom spiritually.” Keith McMullin - Counsellor in Presiding Bishopric
"One, two, three...let's go shopping!" Thomas S Monson - Prophet, Seer, Revelator
Drifting, I don't think he will be able to do it. Apart from the mention of Melchizadec in the Old Testament and the connection of that mysterious figure to Jesus in the New Testament, there is no other mention of such a priesthood (one reference in Psalms is prophetic to Jesus). The New Testament does mention priesthood but I think Mormons have been so fixated on the idea of priesthood and the way they graft it into their system that they cannot understand it in any other context. Gdemetz, keeps throwing up the quote about Aaron being "called of god". Well of course he was and the quote is valid in terms of the Levitical priesthood which was the priesthood within the Jewish structure. It was the only priesthood and the Bible makes it clear that it was the exclusive ministry of the Tribe of Levi which would automatically exclude Mormons from holding it were it a priesthood that still had any significance today. Even Jesus could not hold it since he was of the wrong tribe which is why it was necessary for him to become a high priest after the order of Melchizadec to fulfill the role of the high priest by entering the Holy of Holies and making a total and final intercession on behalf of sinners. He did not need to sacrifice animals, as was the custom, but made the ultimate sacrifice of himself. The need for priestly intercessions is over...Christ is the believers high priest making that intercession on behalf of believers.
