Mormon Apologetics & Misogyny: The Case of William Schryver

[_Chap]

Teancum at 12:17 commenting on Scott Barton:

Yes a clarification would help since I deleted a response I made to Will's extrordinary claim and deleted it based on the moderators comment which I saw after the fact.

[_mercyngrace]

Was that posted just before the other deletions? I did not see it.

But the nice thing is that the moderators over there know what Schryver actually posted, since it is hard to delete a post without reading it ...

They already knew about the Emma Smith comment. I brought it up about a year ago or so ago when Will made a similar challenge regarding his posting history.

[_beastie]

They already knew about the Emma Smith comment. I brought it up about a year ago or so ago when Will made a similar challenge regarding his posting history.

Did Will deny calling Emma a bitch at that time?

[Guest]

They already knew about the Emma Smith comment. I brought it up about a year ago or so ago when Will made a similar challenge regarding his posting history.

Did Will deny calling Emma a bitch at that time?

No. He did note that he had already apologized for doing so.

Calling him out landed me the fabulous prize of a several day long PM exchange with another board regular who called me to repentance for not being loyal.

[_Chap]

They already knew about the Emma Smith comment. I brought it up about a year ago or so ago when Will made a similar challenge regarding his posting history.

Did Will deny calling Emma a bitch at that time?

I bet not. He probably did not think he could get away with it. But given the paranoia and conspiracy theories currently sweeping the apologist camp in the wake of their loss of the Maxwell Institute, he probably thought it might be worth launching a conspiracy theory of his own.

And to judge from the immediate protection afforded him by the MADmods, he may have guessed right at least as far as the Endangered Apologists Conservation Zoo is concerned.

Edited to add: I see from mercyandgrace that I bet right!

[_mercyngrace]

I bet not. He probably did not think he could get away with it. But given the paranoia and conspiracy theories currently sweeping the apologist camp in the wake of their loss of the Maxwell Institute, he probably thought it might be worth launching a conspiracy theory of his own.

And to judge from the immediate protection afforded him by the MADmods, he may have guessed right at least as far as the Endangered Apologists Conservation Zoo is concerned.

Edited to add: I see from mercyandgrace that I bet right!

The poster who reprimanded me via PM has published with MI, though I do not think he is officially associated with the institution. He may not be aware that I know his name in real life but I have to say, knowing that he values loyalty above decency has colored my impression of everything he writes. How can I know whether he is speaking his true beliefs or just running defense in some sort of rhetorical sport?

[Guest]

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[_Kevin Graham]

Calling him out landed me the fabulous prize of a several day long PM exchange with another board regular who called me to repentance for not being loyal.

LOL!

Let me guess, it was Pahoran!

[_Blixa]

Did Will deny calling Emma a bitch at that time?

No. He did note that he had already apologized for doing so.

Calling him out landed me the fabulous prize of a several day long PM exchange with another board regular who called me to repentance for not being loyal.

He actually never did apologize, or at least get back to me with an apology after doing some more reading. I remember this because this was the only online interaction I have ever had with Will Schryver. His nasty remarks to people like liz and beastie (which in classic sexist manner concentrated on their age and appearance) convinced me to stay far away from him.

However, that screed about Emma was beyond even his usual "manly" preening. Suffice it to say, Joseph Smith would have been appalled by his comments and nothing in later Will's protestations ("high maintenance" etc) has any shred of historical accuracy given the sheer amount of wearing physical labor Emma conducted, especially in the Nauvoo period when she was both running an ad hoc home hospital/hostel and traveling extensively to carry out Smith's business deals. She did not sit in a fancy house ordering servants around and pitching a fit when the wrong kind of sewing machine was delivered (I'm referring of course to Amelia Folsom Young).

I find the prodigious heartache she went through in her life, which didn't stop after Joseph's tragic assassination, more of an occasion for empathy than thoughtless snark, no matter what questions I might still have about the dynamics of her relationship with Joseph Smith.

[_mercyngrace]

Blixa,

It took me a while to find the exchange I had with Will but here's a link to the thread and post where Will apologized for his comment about Emma Smith.

http://www.mormondialogue.org/topic/539 ... 1208997862

He links to a thread on this board:

viewtopic.php?p=438461#p438461

At MDDB he concluded his comment (for those who can't see it) with the following remarks:

The bottom line is this: I have composed many a post of sharp, cutting prose over the years. I regret very, very few of them, and would not take them back. But the one where I unjustifiably characterized Emma Hale Smith using a vulgar term is one I do regret, and I both acknowledge my fault in the matter and publicly apologize for it.