Devastating Assessment of FARMS Legacy

[_Kishkumen]

I took Greek history from Huntsman. I loved that class. Funny story is that I dropped a Bill Hamblin class on ANE to take it. Hamblin showed up the first day and announced that his goal for the first day was to get at least half of us to drop the class. He then proceeded to tell us how he was a ridiculously hard grader who would bury us in mounds of paper to read. He then expressed disappointment that no one was getting up to leave. What kind of teacher is that? I am very glad I dropped the class. It was too late to switch majors at that point but the classics have remained a big hobby of mine ever since.

I had Greek History, Athenian Empire, and Thucydides with Huntsman. I may have had him for myth too. I heard Hamblin lecture once, and I visited him in his office once too. I did get the big ego vibe from him.

[_Kishkumen]

I had Lounsbury. Damn, that was a long time ago.

I had Lounsbury too. He's an interesting fellow. How a non-LDS guy functions in Provo for so long....

He loves the gym. I sometimes saw him hitting the weights at Golds.

[_Kishkumen]

Among the old guard still active, I had Huntsman, Macfarlane, and Lounsbury. I never had Peek or Duckwitz. Lounsbury and Macfarlane were my favorite teachers -- not that Huntsman was bad (his Book of Mormon class was a bright moment in the drudgery I put in to meet the religion requirement), but I liked them better. I also had Tueller and Tortorelli, both of whom have since moved on, and Hall, who is not teaching anymore.

Tueller didn't last long. I met him when I interviewed at BYU. Tortorelli is a wild man. How he put up with Provo is something I can't even imagine. I think he is getting married or has. I had Roger for most of my lower level Latin after the first year. I like Roger, and I probably owe him for not getting hired at BYU, and I mean that in a good sense, even though he did not intend it in a positive way.

[_Kishkumen]

*Latin love*

I've recently been reading Marilynne Robinson's book of essays, When I Was a Child I Read Books. I think she is one of the best living prose stylists writing in English (her first novel, Housekeeping, is breath-taking on a sentence by sentence level). I found her remarks on her literary background most elucidating (please forgive such a long quotation, but I think it is necessary for the arrival of Cicero at the end of it):

That was highly enjoyable, Blixa! Thanks for the introduction.

[_Cicero]

Thanks for posting that Blixa. I'll add Housekeeping to my reading list.

I grew up in Utah and went to law school in Massachusetts so I can relate to her experience . . . although I definitely didn't read Horace or Virgil in high school.

I guess it should be obvious from my handle, but I really enjoy reading Cicero for precisely the reason that she mentions (I get an inordinate amount of pleasure when I "get" the irony after repeated readings).

[_Kishkumen]

Thanks for posting that Blixa. I'll add Housekeeping to my reading list.

I grew up in Utah and went to law school in Massachusetts so I can relate to her experience . . . although I definitely didn't read Horace or Virgil in high school.

I guess it should be obvious from my handle, but I really enjoy reading Cicero for precisely the reason that she mentions (I get an inordinate amount of pleasure when I "get" the irony after repeated readings).

I wish I had the honor of reading the Philippics with you this past spring! It was a blast.

[_Blixa]

Thanks for posting that Blixa. I'll add Housekeeping to my reading list.

I grew up in Utah and went to law school in Massachusetts so I can relate to her experience . . . although I definitely didn't read Horace or Virgil in high school.

I guess it should be obvious from my handle, but I really enjoy reading Cicero for precisely the reason that she mentions (I get an inordinate amount of pleasure when I "get" the irony after repeated readings).

Housekeeping is an amazing first novel, but Robinson is also an interesting writer on religion, as a believing Christian (and one who identifies as a Calvinist!). This Paris Review interview is a good introduction to her very interesting oeuvre. I quite like it when she says: "Religion is a framing mechanism. It is a language of orientation that presents itself as a series of questions. It talks about the arc of life and the quality of experience in ways that I’ve found fruitful to think about." Indeed, thinking about the great framing narratives of the Bible has become extremely interesting to me lately.

Here is an interesting discussion of a recent lecture of hers at Calvin College. I quite agree with her when she says, "“We live in a time when the claiming of a religious identity has become more important than abiding in what that truth implies.” No kidding, this very thread itself attests to that.

(Her fiction is never overtly preachy, by the way, she is a religious writer more nuanced than even Flannery O' Connor. There is not one shred of condescension toward "the secular" in any of her work, nor anything other than respect for the various framing narratives of mankind.)

[Guest]

Thanks for posting that Blixa. I'll add Housekeeping to my reading list.

I grew up in Utah and went to law school in Massachusetts so I can relate to her experience . . . although I definitely didn't read Horace or Virgil in high school.

I guess it should be obvious from my handle, but I really enjoy reading Cicero for precisely the reason that she mentions (I get an inordinate amount of pleasure when I "get" the irony after repeated readings).

I wish I had the honor of reading the Philippics with you this past spring! It was a blast.

I am guessing that you had the pleasure of reading them in Latin. I fantasize about having the time in retirement to learn enough Latin to be able to read Cicero in his native tongue. I learned after being able to read Don Quixote and One Hundred Years of Solitude in Spanish that a translated version never can fully capture the full brilliance of the original work. If only Joseph Smith had decided to just publish the gold plates in their native reformed Egyptian and commanded us all only to read it in its native form (like the Quran) . . . just imagine all the problems that would have solved?

[_Blixa]

I am guessing that you had the pleasure of reading them in Latin. I fantasize about having the time in retirement to learn enough Latin to be able read Cicero in his native tongue. I learned after being able to read Don Quixote and One Hundred Years of Solitude in Spanish that a translated version never can fully capture the full brilliance of the original work. If only Joseph Smith had decided to just publish the gold plates in their native reformed Egyptian and commanded us all only to read it in its native form (like the Quran) . . . just imagine all the problems that would have solved?

Here is the key. Wheelock has tutored us all. You'll be reading Pro Caelio and Oratio in Catilinam in no time. (I still remember a final where I had to translate excerpts from Oratio in Catilinam Prima in Senatu Habita aloud.)

[_Kishkumen]

Here is the key. Wheelock has tutored us all. You'll be reading Pro Caelio and Oratio in Catilinam in no time. (I still remember a final where I had to translate excerpts from Oratio in Catilinam Prima in Senatu Habita aloud.)

Second Blixa's recommendation. Wheelock is the current standard for beginning Latin on the college level. Do it. You'll never regret it.