Inactivity and "Coming out"

[_DrW]

Cicero,

Once you really know that the LDS Church is not what it claims to be, and then realize how much of your life has been devoted to what is essentially a lie (or rather an elaborate collection of lies and fantasy), it takes some time to re-orient yourself.

If you have visited some of the other Mormon recovery boards, ones more oriented to newly awakened soon to be ex-Mormons, you will note that the hallmark in advice there is to take it slowly.

In my case, I reduced activity, took opportunities to point out to my wife the problems with the Church when the opportunity arose, and displayed a general lack of interest in the CHurch while displaying more interest in the kids, travel, etc. I continually assured my wife that she was more important to me than anything else in the world and that, at her request and because I loved her, I would maintain some level of activity in the Church.

I focused on her and the family and tried to do things with her and the kids that did not involve the Church.

As I have described before on this board, at some point one gets called to the office of the Bishop. I can guarantee you when that happened in my case, it was not an experience the Bishop would want to have again. There was no acrimony as such, just a friendly explanation of why the LDS Church could not be considered anything but a massive fraud and why anyone with an ounce of integrity, once realizing this, would disengage from it.

Within a few years, the kids realized that there was life outside the Church, they learned that they would not be miserable if they missed a Sunday (or two or three) to go boating or camping.

My wife is now NOM. I have not attended (except for weddings and funeral)s for about ten years.

Things in the marriage and the family are fine - more than fine, actually. My kids often now remark about the severe problems that other Mormon kids they grew up with have faced because of their overly strict Mormon upbringing. Our kids have been allowed to make their own choices with regard to the Church.

But they have seen that their parents are as honest and caring and fair-minded as the parents of any of their TBM friends. And, they understand that their Dad has a lot more personal integrity than some of the adults they know who attend Church regularly but definitely do not live the gospel.

Reading your OP, I doubt that you will ever be able to go back. So, my advice ('cause you sort of asked for it) is to decide where you want to be in 2 years and in 5 years, figure out a plan to get there realizing that there will be mid course corrections, and let your wife in on the plan as soon as she is ready to listen.

If the plan requires you to continue to attend Church for a while, look at it as service to your wife and family. You were all a long time getting in and it will take some time to get out.

Be willing to speak up now and then in Church (especially PH meeting so as not to embarrass your wife) when the teachers says something that is really silly or clearly not true. In my case (especially after my little talk with the Bishop) folks were willing to cut me a lot of slack at Church.

Oh, and stop paying tithing. Do that for sure. Nothing helps the wife see the benefits of NOMIsm or apostasy like a 10% raise.

If your wife asks you about tithing, explain to her that the interest alone on what you have already paid would reimburse the Church's expenses "directly attributable" to you for as long as you wish to attend. (e.g. what would be the cost for the use of a million dollar (at most) building for 5 or six hours a week if shared among 400 members? Because that is the only tangible value the LDS Church provides its members).

Good luck.

[_Blixa]

I have no hang up about the witnesses. But I am pretty impressed with their stories and with their testimonies. There was reason why 11 were chosen. 11 is a big number. One can rationalized 3 or 2 but 11. It is problematic. They had an experience that could never be forgotten or rationalized away. And as you know, we humans are great at rationalizations.

I nominate that last sentence for Most Ironic Post Fragment of the Year.

You are easily impressed, that's all I have to say. The Lord came up with one more witness than you could count on your fingers, proving beyond a shadow of a doubt that it must be true.

I always wondered if we'd ever learn what kind of arcane and possibly gematric association the number has for why me, why he repeats it over and over like an incantation or spell. If I recall correctly, the number signifies disorder in various Biblical traditions, though I believe it was given positive attributes in Aleister Crowley's Thelemic writing. It is also the atomic number of sodium. Maybe the reason was to be found in mathematics: base 11? L. Ron Hubbard references the undecimal counting system in Battlefield Earth and Carl Sagan also makes use of it in his novel, Contact.

I have to say the reveal has been anticlimactic: 11 is a big number. Bigger than 3 or 2.

[_Themis]

One of the posters who made a comment to me about warm feelings in the tummy.

So? Does this poster say that is the only type of internal experience? Also how does that make other internal experiences from some divine being?

[_Tchild]

If you are one of those folks, did you find that "coming out" and going inactive for a time actually helped you in your faith journey?

Mormonism did not satisfy me on any level. While I was a believer that disastisfaction manifested itself in many of the symptoms that posters (like yourself) notice and comment on. Mormonism just made me absolutely miserable.

in my opinion, a "faith journey" should be a sheer joy to travel. It is discovery, growth, truth, openness, transparency and most of all it is pure honesty with yourself.

Fear is what keeps most people off of that personal journey, but what is there to fear?

If you have to struggle with your faith or your belief, that faith or belief is what is the problem, not you the individual. Discard it and keep searching. When you find your journey or path, you know it deep down and it is no longer a struggle or labor, but a pleasure.

Good luck

[_Sethbag]

You are easily impressed, that's all I have to say. The Lord came up with one more witness than you could count on your fingers, proving beyond a shadow of a doubt that it must be true.

I always wondered if we'd ever learn what kind of arcane and possibly gematric association the number has for why me, why he repeats it over and over like an incantation or spell. If I recall correctly, the number signifies disorder in various Biblical traditions, though I believe it was given positive attributes in Aleister Crowley's Thelemic writing. It is also the atomic number of sodium. Maybe the reason was to be found in mathematics: base 11? L. Ron Hubbard references the undecimal counting system in Battlefield Earth and Carl Sagan also makes use of it in his novel, Contact.

I have to say the reveal has been anticlimactic: 11 is a big number. Bigger than 3 or 2.

He's fixated on 11 because 11 is the number that just happened to be. If it had been 12, he'd have talked about a "quorum" of witnesses. If it had been 13, it would have been a Baker's Dozen of witnesses, and how rich in symbolic meaning that is because we wear Baker's hats in the temple. If it had been 10 witnesses it would have been remarkable for matching the natural radix of human arithmetic. 9 witnesses would have been a holy "three" of "threes", etc.

On the other hand, I like how you mention that 11 is the atomic number of sodium. That is half the chemical makeup of salt, and any scripture worth its salt would have good witnesses, so...

[_Bob Loblaw]

11 is also one of the lighter weights for canvas, a.k.a. "cotton duck."

[_Yong Xi]

I think why me just has an affinity for those who were in and out of the Church repeatedly, while still claiming to have a testimony of the Book of Mormon. Why me believes he is in good company with such stalwart men.

I suppose someday, mimicking The Three Witnesses, an inactive or estranged why me will testify on his own deathbed of the truth of the Book of Mormon.

[_Sethbag]

11 is also one of the lighter weights for canvas, a.k.a. "cotton duck."

Oh how richly symbolic! The Book of Mormon is God's canvas, upon which he paints for us a 2nd witness for Jesus Christ, though I'm not sure if it still counts as a 2nd witness to just copy over the primary points of the 1st witness into a new fictional book. Also, re: cotton duck, having 11 witnesses helps the Book of Mormon "duck" the controversy caused by the New World looking as if there never were any Nephites or Lamanites. I mean, how could archeologists, anthropologists, and all the other -gists be wrong when the Book of Mormon has E l e v e n witnesses? I mean, it's not even close, is it? Science on the one hand, and XI friends, business partners, relatives, etc. of the author and proprietor of that work on the other hand.

[_consiglieri]

So, without wanting to regain a testimony, your question is mute.

Would that you were.

ETA: Looks like Bob beat me to the punch.

[_palerobber]

what i've seen with people in your position is that once they take that first step out the door, a lot of uncertainty and anxiety evaporates, and their journey away from not just the LDS church, but all religious faith, accelerates.

...to put it another way:
people don't realize what they're not missing until they quit. : )