Romney mentions mopologists in debate

[_sock puppet]

You are delusional if you really think this is the sum of Romney's plan (other than perhaps the medicare/voucher plan and I doubt that would get by congress).

Yep. He wouldn't even be able to repeal "Obamacare." The House would vote to repeal, but not the Senate. It's also delusional to think that repealing the Bush tax cuts for the wealthy would put even a small dent in the deficit.

Even if Romney wins, Repubs hold the House, and take the Senate, Obamacare will not be repealed. Romney and his advisors are not stupid. If Obama goes down, it will be over the unfavorable fallout of Obamacare--without the 10-12% of the electorate that moved from favorable to unfavorable for Obama over that, he could have survived the bad economy and been re-elected, waltzing past Nov 6 to re-inauguration day Jan 20, 2013. (I yet think Obama will win, but it would have been a big margin without Obamacare.)

So, if you are new Pres Romney or an advisor to him, having just witnessed one presidency bite the dust over trying to wrestle the behemothly growing, ever devouring health care slice of the GDP, do you really want to undo Obamacare, take your own whack at that beast, and go down in 2016 too?

To fulfill a campaign promise, Romney would publicly promise the House that if it passes a bill to repeal Obamacare and can get the Senate to go along, he Romney will sign the repeal. Secretly, his advisors would be meeting with some wobbly, select Repub Senators to let them know that they would not incur any wrath from the White House if they were to either be absent on the day of the vote on the repeal bill or even vote against it. Bottles of sparkling apple cider would be being popped secretly in the White House when the Senate does not pass the repeal measure. And you would almost be able to hear Romney's sigh of relief all the way in Los Angeles.

Obamacare is here to stay.

[_Bob Loblaw]

Obamacare is here to stay.

Agreed. In the abstract, Americans say they dislike Obama's healthcare law, but when asked about specific provisions of the law, they are overwhelmingly in favor. Even if the law were incredibly unpopular, there's no way it would be repealed. People who think Romney will repeal Obamacare are as delusional as those who think Republicans will make contraception illegal.

[_Equality]

Will any aspect of Romney's Mormonism and its potential impact on policy decisions come up in the next two debates? Or is it simply completely off limits? Should it be? Personally, I think he should be asked about it--Is there anything in his religious beliefs that influences his positions on public policy? If so, what specifically? (Is he for higher taxes on cigarettes, coffee, alcohol, and tea, for example?) I guess what I am wondering is whether it is possible to discuss his Mormonism in a way that is not an attack on his beliefs but is rather an exploration of how his deeply held religious beliefs might affect the decisions he makes as President.

[_Bob Loblaw]

Will any aspect of Romney's Mormonism and its potential impact on policy decisions come up in the next two debates? Or is it simply completely off limits? Should it be? Personally, I think he should be asked about it--Is there anything in his religious beliefs that influences his positions on public policy? If so, what specifically? (Is he for higher taxes on cigarettes, coffee, alcohol, and tea, for example?) I guess what I am wondering is whether it is possible to discuss his Mormonism in a way that is not an attack on his beliefs but is rather an exploration of how his deeply held religious beliefs might affect the decisions he makes as President.

Isn't the next debate supposed to be about foreign policy? The last one, I believe, is a townhall thing, so it could easily come up there, unless of course Romney has an agreement ahead of time not to field questions about religion.

For me, religion is only an issue insofar as it informs one's political beliefs, but then I'm more interested in the political beliefs than where they came from. If he were running on a platform saying "vote for me, I'm religious," I'd be inclined to go into his religion. But other than that, I don't see that it's an important consideration. Contra bcspace, I don't believe Obama's religious history is particularly relevant to how he has governed, either.

[_sock puppet]

Will any aspect of Romney's Mormonism and its potential impact on policy decisions come up in the next two debates? Or is it simply completely off limits? Should it be? Personally, I think he should be asked about it--Is there anything in his religious beliefs that influences his positions on public policy? If so, what specifically? (Is he for higher taxes on cigarettes, coffee, alcohol, and tea, for example?) I guess what I am wondering is whether it is possible to discuss his Mormonism in a way that is not an attack on his beliefs but is rather an exploration of how his deeply held religious beliefs might affect the decisions he makes as President.

Was Obama asked this about Reverend Jeremiah Wright at the 2008 presidential debates? I do not recall either way.

[_Equality]

Mark it on your calendars. I agree with why me on something. Romney looked better than he has looked since he won the nomination. But targeting Big Bird as his only specific budget cut is going to undermine it all. Just wait and see. If he had anything else specific re: budget cuts, it would not have been so bad.

This is simply nonesense. He did not target PBS as his ONLY cut. He said we have to look at things like PBS and decide if it is worth borrowing from China to continue to fund such things.

And of course Romney know that PBS and other non essential programs are not going get us out of debt alone. Entitlement reforms, defense spending reform (though Mitt gets and F on that one), revenue generation through a stronger economy as well as tax increases (Romney does not do well there either) will. But that does not mean we should not look at smaller budget items. It all adds up.

It is not nonsense. I said it was the only SPECIFIC budget cut he mentioned all night. That is true. He has repeatedly said that his massive across-the-board tax cut would be revenue neutral because he will close loopholes and eliminate deductions. But he has also repeatedly refused to specify any such loopholes or deductions. He has also said he would reduce the deficit (in addition to paying for the tax cut). He will do this by increasing the military budget by $2 trillion, restoring to the Medicare budget the 700 billion dollars that Obamacare takes from it (and which the Ryan budget also takes from it, which budget Mitt previously said he would have signed), keeping all the popular parts of Obamacare (pre-existing condition coverage, coverage on kids until they are 26) while eliminating the parts of Obamacare that make the popular provisions possible. When asked what he would cut to bring down the deficit, he named one thing--PBS, which makes up 1/100 of 1% of the entire federal budget. The fact is (and all the politicians know this but don't dare say it) is you can't really balance the budget long term without significant budget cuts to what is now called nondiscretionary spending. That means military, Medicare, Medicaid, and Social Security. And it can't be done withut significant increases in revenue, either.

And we are not borrowing from the Chinese to fund PBS. That's just dumb. The Chinese own about 8% of the U.S. debt. But that doesn't mean we "borrowed" from them to fund Big Bird.

Face it: Mitt is being squirrelly here, something I think he learned how to do on his mission and in his years as a Mormon church leader. He learned the corporate slick sales techniques that the Mormon church has been perfecting since the days it was founded by the charlatan Joseph Smith.

[_Equality]

If he were running on a platform saying "vote for me, I'm religious," I'd be inclined to go into his religion.

Actually, I think he HAS said that (and I know many of his supporters think it makes him more qualified. I wonder how many Mormons would have voted for him over, say, Rick Santorum in the primary if Romney were a Catholic.)

[_Bob Loblaw]

Actually, I think he HAS said that (and I know many of his supporters think it makes him more qualified. I wonder how many Mormons would have voted for him over, say, Rick Santorum in the primary if Romney were a Catholic.)

I haven't seen him say that. Of course, it's impossible to get the Republican nomination without being religious, but I don't think he's been out on the stump asking for votes because he's Mormon. As for Santorum, most Mormon Republicans, like my father, think he's too extreme on social issues. That says a lot, doesn't it?

[_Equality]

Actually, I think he HAS said that (and I know many of his supporters think it makes him more qualified. I wonder how many Mormons would have voted for him over, say, Rick Santorum in the primary if Romney were a Catholic.)

I haven't seen him say that. Of course, it's impossible to get the Republican nomination without being religious, but I don't think he's been out on the stump asking for votes because he's Mormon.

No, not because he is Mormon. That is true. But he did have all those folks at the convention talk about him as a Mormon and how that makes him better qualified to be President. And he has said that being a person of faith is required to be a good moral leader. And he has injected religion into the race by running ads saying that Obama is conducting a "war on religion" (which may be true if we are talking about all the Muslims being killed in Pakistan, Yemen, etc. by U.S. drones, but I don't think that is what Mitt is referring to).

[_Bob Loblaw]

No, not because he is Mormon. That is true. But he did have all those folks at the convention talk about him as a Mormon and how that makes him better qualified to be President. And he has said that being a person of faith is required to be a good moral leader. And he has injected religion into the race by running ads saying that Obama is conducting a "war on religion" (which may be true if we are talking about all the Muslims being killed in Pakistan, Yemen, etc. by U.S. drones, but I don't think that is what Mitt is referring to).

That is standard GOP rhetoric, unfortunately. Bush said the same things, but his religion didn't become an issue until he said that Jesus was his favorite philosopher.

And I agree that there's no war on religion.