Did Joseph Smith claim he was descended from Jesus?

[Guest]

Salt Lake Tribune (2007): "Book says Smith came from Jesus' family tree."

Read it, worked through many of the footnotes. They guy doesn't have a case. Whenever Joseph Smith (and some other people) said something fague (like "no man knows my history), this author claims they were talking about Joseph Smith descending from Jesus.

Author thinks the marriage of Lucy and Joseph, Sr. united two branches of the descendents of Jesus to produce . . . Joseph, Jr.

The closest he comes is some quotes about the first Mormon apostles being related, north Europeans being of the house of Israel, that sort of thing.

I almost wish it were true (not in the literal sense, just in early Mormons taught it). Because if you join it with the Joseph Smith as Holy Ghost incarnate, that would make Lucy, a descendent of Jesus the Mother of God.

And you know how much I like Lucy.

But alas, it doesn't work.

It does have some nice pictures though.


ETA Darth J posted while I was posting. Some good stuff. I don't remember anything that good in Swenson, but its been a while since I read it. I'm surprised Correlation would let that Church News article out as late as 2010. Weren't we supposed to be mainstream by then?

[_Drifting]

The memories of anti Mormons are usually vague enough to imagine all sorts of things.

LDS Church News, Dec. 18, 2010

Visiting Joseph on Sept. 21, 1823, the Book of Mormon prophet Moroni in angelic form quoted a number of biblical passages, among them this verse from Isaiah:

"And there shall come forth a rod out of the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots" (Isaiah 11:1).

Some 15 years later, the Prophet would provide a divinely revealed explanation of this verse in the form of questions and responses recorded today as Doctrine and Covenants 113:1-4: "Who is the Stem of Jesse spoken of in the 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, and 5th verses of the 11th chapter of Isaiah?

"Verily thus saith the Lord: It is the Christ.

"What is the rod spoken of in the first verse of the 11th chapter of Isaiah, that should come of the Stem of Jesse?

"Behold, thus saith the Lord: It is a servant in the hands of Christ, who is partly a descendant of Jesse as well as of Ephraim, or of the house of Joseph, on whom there is laid much power."

Commented Elder Bruce R. McConkie of the Quorum of the Twelve, "Are we amiss in saying that the prophet here mentioned is Joseph Smith, to whom the priesthood came, who received the keys of the kingdom, and who raised the ensign for the gathering of the Lord's people in our dispensation?"

Alexander W. Baugh, professor of Church history and doctrine at BYU commented, "On Dec. 9, 1834, Joseph Smith Sr. pronounced a patriarchal blessing on Joseph Smith Jr. wherein he declared that the Prophet was a lineal descendant and birthright heir to the patriarchal fathers Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, but more particularly Joseph of Egypt. Furthermore, Brigham Young declared that Joseph Smith was a descendant of Joseph through Ephraim (Journal of Discourses 2:269).

"Additionally, Doctrine and Covenants 113:6 states that the 'root of Jesse' as spoken of in Isaiah 11:10 is 'a descendant of Jesse, as well as of Joseph, unto whom rightly belongs the priesthood, and the keys of the kingdom for an ensign, and for the gathering of my people in the last days.' Such wording suggests the individual to be none other than Joseph Smith."

Jesse, in biblical history, is the father of David, making him the ancestor of the kings of Judah and of Christ (see Ruth 4:17,22; 1 Chronicles 2:5-12; Matthew 1:5-6; Bible Dictionary, "Jesse" entry).

Where did bcspace go?

[_ludwigm]

Where did bcspace go?

Into the wilderness.

[_iamse7en]

No, he never claimed it, despite what the Godmakers says. Others have supposed it though.

[_Kishkumen]

I managed to put this together from things that Hugh Nibley said in class. He demonstrated unusual interest in the book Holy Blood, Holy Grail, and I was curious, so I read it. Then I recalled seeing some genealogical stemmata of Joseph Smith and Brigham Young in a stake genealogical library and noting how similar these were to the stemmata in that book. Then I took a course with Joseph Fielding McConkie in which he taught, using scriptures, that the early Brethren were the seed of Christ in a literal sense.

Finally, I got up the nerve to ask someone close to me who is a descendant of George Q. Cannon whether this person had ever heard a family story about being descended from Jesus. With a shocked look, the person responded, "Why yes, my grandmother told me that our family was better than another family, because we are descended from Jesus."

[_Alter Idem]

Kishkumen, I don't know what the Cannon family believed, but I'm a great great granddaughter of Hyrum Smith and I can tell my experience. I was NEVER told that we were descended from Jesus, EVER. I only learned about the belief that Jesus had children and descendants from the Book 'Holy Blood Holy Grail' and it doesn't mention Mormons or Joseph Smith.

I learned about the theory that some have that Joseph Smith was a descendant of Jesus from message boards like this one where this claim was discussed.

My family has a large genealogical chart that follows the family lines back to Adam and frankly that's pretty common for families that do genealogy because if you tie into the Royal lines of Europe, they took their genealogical lines back to Adam. If you think my family was out of the loop, I'm sure we were not. We've attended the Smith family reunions, I served on the committee and as President of the family association and close family members were involved in the genealogy gathering and family goings on, so if this was something widely believed among family members, I should have heard it at some time.

This is a belief that has been bandied about by others--NOT by the Smith family, in my experience.

[_lulu]

Thanks for putting that up. If I'm in the mood on the weekend, I might go back through Swensen and post what I think is his best evidence. As I posted before, I don't remember it being very good.

Kishkumen, I don't know what the Cannon family believed, but I'm a great great granddaughter of Hyrum Smith and I can tell my experience. I was NEVER told that we were descended from Jesus, EVER. I only learned about the belief that Jesus had children and descendants from the Book 'Holy Blood Holy Grail' and it doesn't mention Mormons or Joseph Smith.

I learned about the theory that some have that Joseph Smith was a descendant of Jesus from message boards like this one where this claim was discussed.

My family has a large genealogical chart that follows the family lines back to Adam and frankly that's pretty common for families that do genealogy because if you tie into the Royal lines of Europe, they took their genealogical lines back to Adam. If you think my family was out of the loop, I'm sure we were not. We've attended the Smith family reunions, I served on the committee and as President of the family association and close family members were involved in the genealogy gathering and family goings on, so if this was something widely believed among family members, I should have heard it at some time.

This is a belief that has been bandied about by others--NOT by the Smith family, in my experience.

[_Alter Idem]

Lulu, I went back and read the things Darth J. posted from the news article.

That information. about Joseph being descended from Jesse-

I will tell you what my family traditions were on this subject. We believed that the Smiths probably had jewish blood and this was the meaning of those scriptures. We never read it to think that we were descended from Jesus.

And in all my years of church attendance, I knew that many early LDS leaders believed that Jesus was married, but never heard anyone claim he'd had children.

It wasn't until I read Holy Blood Holy Grail and later, the Da Vinci Code novel, and other sources regarding legends about Jeremiah taking Mary and her daughter Sarah to France, that I find out that anyone believed that Jesus had descendants.

Besides, What these theories claim, actually means that MANY people living today would be able to claim being descended from Jesus since many people can trace their lineage into the royal houses of Europe which would likely tie them into the Merovingion lines of France.

[_lulu]

Thanks Alder Idem.

The short answer to the question in the subline, I've found no such claim. However, later some church leaders might have made that claim for Joseph Smith and made it for other early church leaders.

This will come in more piecemeal than I would have wanted, and I might even make some mistakes, but hey, you do what you can do.

Vern Grosvenor Swanson, Dynasty of the Holy Grail Cedar Fort 2006.

Swanson's (I have mistakenly referred to him as Swensen in earlier posts) point is that Joseph Smith, Sr. was of Judah-Jesse and that Lucy was of Ephriam. Thus, Joseph Smith. Jr. recombined those 2 genetic strands within his body.

He starts with the idea that not only was Jesus married he was a polygamist. One of his wives was Mary Magdalene. Jesus was of the tribe of Judah (who knew) and Mary Magdalene was of the tribe of Ephraim.

He then goes through Jesus in England along with Anne (did you know she was a native of the isle) Joseph of Arimathea, the Virgin and Mary Magdalene. The whole British Israel thing.

He doubles back around to the importance of linage with Abraham, Isaac, Jacob.

There's also some Lost Tribes stuff to keep the Ephraim side going.

He traces at more length than I can deal with various legends of the Holy Grail as well as European geneologies.

And then we get the English to New England.

Heber C. Kimball: Did you actually know Joseph Smith? No. Do you know Brother Brigham? No. Do you know Brother Heber? No,you do not. Do you know the Twelve? You do not; if you did, you would begin to know God, and learn that those men who are chosen to direct and counsel you are near kindred to God and Jesus Christ, for the keys, power, and authority of the kindgom of God are in that linage. 368 citing Heber C. Kimball, Journal of Discourses (1 March 1857), 4:248a.

As to Joseph Smith himself, that's as good as it gets in terms of a direct statement. Swanson has better evidence as to it being thought that early leaders were descendants of Jesus. I'll try and come back to that.

[_MCB]

I looked up Swanson's book, it is out of print and hard to find secondhand. A second edition is due to be released in Feb. Seems to be a bit more imaginative than the Book of Mormon. Carry on.