'Priesthood' - an illusory concept?

[_Chap]

I think there is confusion around the concept of priesthood. There is temporal priesthood and priesthood from God. The temporal priesthood is nothing more than people presuming to act in the name of God. You'll find this in any Church including the Mormon Church. It is simply for officiating ordinance, administrative duties and so on. There is nothing magical or mystical about it at all and this is the priesthood that many Mormons seem to attach more significance to than they should. The other priesthood, the authority of God, can only come from and be granted by God to a person. This is rare and if you encounter someone with this kind of priesthood, it will be manifest - no question. This is the kind of priesthood that the scriptures talk about and that Deborah, Elijah, Christ, Moses and others had.

Did God give you the Priesthood when he visited you in person?

Look, you just have to have faith. Stop asking Tobin for justification of his utterances, and humbly accept that he knows of what he speaks.

Tobin wants you to believe in him, but if he gave you any rational reason to do so, there would be no merit in your making the unforced choice to believe.

So just do it. You will feel all warm inside afterwards, I promise.

[_Drifting]

Look, you just have to have faith. Stop asking Tobin for justification of his utterances, and humbly accept that he knows of what he speaks.

Tobin wants you to believe in him, but if he gave you any rational reason to do so, there would be no merit in your making the unforced choice to believe.

So just do it. You will feel all warm inside afterwards, I promise.

This issue being Tobin would then be expecting us to have faith whilst he himself doesn't need faith (because he has seen God) thereby making his purpose on earth null and void.

What I mean is that if our purpose here is to exercise faith to come to know God, then Tobin's journey is over. Or he is lying/delusional.

[_Chap]

Look, you just have to have faith. Stop asking Tobin for justification of his utterances, and humbly accept that he knows of what he speaks.

Tobin wants you to believe in him, but if he gave you any rational reason to do so, there would be no merit in your making the unforced choice to believe.

So just do it. You will feel all warm inside afterwards, I promise.

This issue being Tobin would then be expecting us to have faith whilst he himself doesn't need faith (because he has seen God) thereby making his purpose on earth null and void.

What I mean is that if our purpose here is to exercise faith to come to know God, then Tobin's journey is over. Or he is lying/delusional.

I think you need to pray and read your scriptures more, and stop watching porn. Then the Spirit will return and your hard heart will open to the truth..

[_Drifting]

I think you need to pray and read your scriptures more, and stop watching porn. Then the Spirit will return and your hard heart will open to the truth..

I'm leaving because you've just offended me, pass the alcohol and cigarettes...

[_Tobin]

I think there is confusion around the concept of priesthood. There is temporal priesthood and priesthood from God. The temporal priesthood is nothing more than people presuming to act in the name of God. You'll find this in any Church including the Mormon Church. It is simply for officiating ordinance, administrative duties and so on. There is nothing magical or mystical about it at all and this is the priesthood that many Mormons seem to attach more significance to than they should. The other priesthood, the authority of God, can only come from and be granted by God to a person. This is rare and if you encounter someone with this kind of priesthood, it will be manifest - no question. This is the kind of priesthood that the scriptures talk about and that Deborah, Elijah, Christ, Moses and others had.

Can you name any of the others? I am most interested in anyone this side of the ancient world. As you get closer to now, the more interested I become.

It seems that these people disappear when the human race becomes skeptical and prone to check stories out.

I think Joseph Smith came the closest, but no - I can't think of anyone in the modern-era that has exhibited this kind of priesthood in a remarkable way besides him.

[_RockSlider]

Tobin wants you to believe in him, but if he gave you any rational reason to do so, there would be no merit in your making the unforced choice to believe.

I have not followed Tobin closely, but I've not seen him ever promote any belief in Tobin, only encouraged others that a one to one is available between a man/woman and God.

This issue being Tobin would then be expecting us to have faith whilst he himself doesn't need faith (because he has seen God) thereby making his purpose on earth null and void.
What I mean is that if our purpose here is to exercise faith to come to know God, then Tobin's journey is over. Or he is lying/delusional.

Doctrine and Covenants - the "Doctrine" part of that title was for the Lectures on Faith, which was originally bound as part of the volume. The definition of faith taught in the School of the Prophets is far from the concept of a simple "hope in things not seen", but is based on an a full assurance.

"If men were duly to consider themselves, and turn their thoughts and reflections to the operations of their own minds, they would readily discover that it is faith, and faith only, which is the moving cause of all action, in them; that without it, both mind and body would be in a state of inactivity, and all their exertions would cease, both physical and mental."

The first lecture goes on to explain why this is so. Its based on full expectation and assurance, which actual knowledge would not interfere with.

If Tobin has worked it out in relation with things of God ... more power to him.

[_Sethbag]

Regarding your "passing the baton" comment:

Priesthood needs more than just a priesthood holder to pass the baton. It also REQUIRES approval of the leadership. For example, if I ordained my wife with the Aaronic priesthood, it would not stick because it didn't get a bishop's approval. Same goes for Jesus. His priestood is worthless without his bishop's approval.

What's interesting to me is that if an ordination takes place in the Catholic church without the proper approval from the hierarchy, the ordination is still considered valid, but illicit. All that it takes for the ordination to be considered valid is that it follow the prescribed forms and be performed by someone ordained to the required level of priesthood to perform it.