Post-religion Society

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[_Harold Lee]

@ uncle dale

Except we find people believing in science that have no real understanding ... classic blind faith.
aren't the revered scientists pretty much the same as prophets?

I disagree on that one. You don't need to understand what scientists are doing to be able to tell that they do.

Astrophysicists landed us on the moon, geneticists clone, engineers using those laws created the computer you're typing on with wireless internet, doctors heal- any form of reliable technology is verification that they understood the principles it was built on.

Blind faith from religious leaders tries to persuade you that their understanding is the right one and therefore the laws that any kind of new technology is built on are false, and really Kolob is real, green tea is bad for you, horses and elephants lived in america, and native americans are/were jews.

It's not really blind faith that scientists are right in understanding the structure of an atom, for example, when you can visit a nuclear power plant, watch a video of Hiroshima, or even type on a computer.

[_Ceeboo]

Hey SP (Long time - No type!)

If not, what would be different about human society if our cultures detached from religion?

Just imagine living 24 hours a day in an entire world that is exactly like the MDB!

And simply logging off is not an option.

Peace,
Ceeboo

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[_Harold Lee]

I'm suggesting that there are many in todays world leading a blind faith existence in science , mostly in opposition to religion. They tout science but have no real understanding ... hence blind faith.

That makes sense. There's lots of lazy pseudointellectualism on both sides; that can rightly be interpreted as blind faith of sorts.

[_Uncle Dale]

I like most of what you say, but North Korea is a poor example. It is not really an atheistic society, but a dictatorship, and with dictatorships it's not that uncommon to get people to view them as some kind of deity. I am not sure we have any examples of a real atheistic society.

I'm not sure there are any good examples. Even Plato's
ideal republic had a place for gods (which he and
Socrates before him may have seen as imaginary).

Stalin's Russia still had churches and monasteries --
of which Stalin himself was a human product.

Mao's China still had plenty of religious targets for
the Great Cultural Revolution to go after, years later
in that nation's history.

Probably, rather than nation-states, we ought to look to
atheistic communes or smaller sub-societies in which
such like-minded people gather together, in hopes of
thwarting the religious world surrounding them. But --
even if we can identify a few such examples, I do not
think that any of them will prove viable over time --
the grandkids or the great-grandkids of such atheists
inevitably find allurements in the general social order.

Perhaps the south of France, in 2312, may provide us with
a viable example. That's about the best that I can predict.

Of course, technically, Burma is an atheistic society today;
but its Buddhism is not of the primitive variety and has been
adulterated by popular religion. Shri Lanka, Thailand and
Bali are even less useful examples of atheistic religious states.

Perhaps somebody else can come up with some better examples.

UD

[_Uncle Dale]

@ uncle dale

Except we find people believing in science that have no real understanding ... classic blind faith.
aren't the revered scientists pretty much the same as prophets?

For young children and other immature folks -- no doubt so.
Education that involves actual participation in "Science" as
instructional activities may help counter such immaturity.

I share you're optimism and hope of a more personalized application of the human enigma.

First let me say that I find christian belief the most infantile.
But we can't go chastising the more immature child to validate the more mature. I'm not sure where the best route is ... but someone has to stop the cycle of pointing blame and duality.

There are all sorts of "Christianity," ranging from that of learned
Jesuits to that of backwoods snake-handlers. I sincerely doubt
that Jesus (were he alive today) would avow much of what any of
those many sects promote. Maybe a few bits and pieces of
Christian teachings, here and there -- but not the ball of wax.

I do not look to Christianity to provide the raw material for
future non-supernatural religious groups. Unitarian-Universalism
was a rare exception -- and we should not expect to see much
of that sort of religious evolution among today's Christians.

How future non-supernatural religionists will make use of
Jesus and the scriptural writings supposedly preserving his
teachings, I cannot imagine --- but probably those results
will not much resemble classical mainstream Christianity.

UD

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[_Themis]

I'm not sure there are any good examples.

I agree. China and the Soviet Union are examples of communist dictatorships of a small group of people deciding what the masses should believe or not believe. I think a true example would need to be a group where the masses choose atheism. I always love how people try to use Russia as an example of people leaving atheism to join Christianity, but I would ask were they ever really atheist except in public.