Racism and the Book of Mormon

[_Drifting]

Mormons are not known to be racist...

But past Prophets and Apostles are (see posts earlier in this thread)

...and the LDS church does not teach racism.

Actually it does, in that it teaches children in Primary that God cursed the Lamanites with a skin of blackness (see posts earlier in this thread)

Maybe you are not quite getting it.

Somebody's not getting it...(see earlier posts in this thread)

Do you think that the LDS church is the only church with a past?

It's the only one, with a past where people were discriminated based on skin colour, that hasn't yet apologised nor offered a reason for it. "We don't know why" is not a sufficient explanation. (see posts earlier in this thread)

The protestants wouldn't fare very well either

Please can you show; how the Prtotestants discriminated against people based on skin colour; that they haven't apologised for it if they did it; or where they have stated that they didn't know why it happened, if it happened.

and neither would the catholics or the jews. Or the muslims.

Please can you show; how the Catholics and Jews and Muslims discriminated against people based on skin colour; that they haven't apologised for it if they did it; or where they have stated that they didn't know why it happened, if it happened.

And so what would be the point?

Honest discussion.

[_why me]

Did Barrack Obama spend two years in France telling people to join a church that officially taught that one specific race was categorically unworthy of the priesthood because of something the members of that race did before they were born? Or was it just Mitt Romney who did that?

or that god said the jews are the choosen race? And cain was cursed? Address the post that mary made and stop deflecting.

[_why me]

Honest discussion.

You are not interested in honest discussion but you are interested in playing the blame game. The media is not interested in Mormonism. You and mary need to get over it. But they are interested in Romney, the man.

[_Darth J]

Did Barrack Obama spend two years in France telling people to join a church that officially taught that one specific race was categorically unworthy of the priesthood because of something the members of that race did before they were born? Or was it just Mitt Romney who did that?

or that god said the jews are the choosen race? And cain was cursed? Address the post that mary made and stop deflecting.

I'm not deflecting from anything. Christians don't dispute that the Jews were God's chosen people prior to Peter's vision to take the gospel to the Gentiles. And not all believers in the Bible share the LDS Church's idea that when God cursed Cain, it means that God turned Cain into a Negro (for hell's sake, haven't you ever read East of Eden?)

Your ongoing tu quoque with the Bible while purporting to be a believing Mormon is therefore: (1) a straw man; (2) self-defeating for Mormons; and (3) not impressive to people who don't believe in the self-serving mythology of Bronze Age shepherds.

Given your ongoing opposition to deflections, though, I take it you concede that Governor Romney did in fact spend two years in France trying to get people to join the LDS Church during that century-and-a-half period of time when the Church categorically refused to allow Negroes, and only Negroes, to receive the power to cast spells in the name of Mormon Jesus (officially known as the priesthood).

[_Drifting]

Honest discussion.

You are not interested in honest discussion but you are interested in playing the blame game. The media is not interested in Mormonism. You and mary need to get over it. But they are interested in Romney, the man.

Romney?
We are discussing racism and the Book of Mormon.

[_Darth J]

The media is not interested in Mormonism.

That's funny, because I recently heard that the reason Ann Romney eschewed her temple garments while wearing a short skirt is because the media would love to get a picture of her garments.

We need to remember that the media is trying to get a view of those garments and certainly the photogs are attempting to do this. Much better to leave them off because once the photogs do get a picture they will be all over the media. Not good.

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=26307&start=63

[_SteelHead]

How bout racism in the hymnal (which is a scripture unto the lord):

Example 7. In 1835, 67:3, baptism appeared to affect skin color liter- ally: "And wash the Ethiopian white." The hymn was omitted before 1927.

Example 8. In 1835, 35:4, and again in 1927, 102:4, "There Is Now a Feast for the Righteous Preparing," entire continents are dark and black: "Go pass throughout Europe,/ and Asia's dark regions/ to China's far shores,/ and to Africa's black legions." Although the hymn had been in- cluded by the church for more than one hundred years, it was omitted from the 1948 hymnal; its second verse also contained the line: "To cease from all evil/ and leave off loud mirth," which appeared to encourage dourness, solemnity, and a lack of joy.

Example 9. The 1927, 301:2, and 1948, 127:2, "O'er Gloomy Hills of Darkness" hymn, linked the African Negro, the American Indian, and barbarians: "Let the Indian and the Negro,/ Let the rude barbarian see/ That divine and glorious conquest/ Once obtained on Calvary." This hymn was not retained in the 1985 hymnal.
Native Americans

Example 10. The 1835 and 1927 hymnals contained 63:1 / 64:1: "O stop and tell me, Red Man .../ Have you no God, no home?"; 63:5 / 64:3: "And so our race has dwindled/ to idle Indian hearts"; and 63:4 / 64:4: "And quit their savage customs." Although included by the church for more than 100 years, this hymn was not retained for the 1948 hymnal.
The 1927 hymnal introduced seven hymns mentioning Native Amer- icans. Four of these did not last the twenty-one years to the 1948 hymnal:
77:1 "Great spirit listen to the Red Man's wail!"

From: http://www.dialoguejournal.com/wp-conte ... N03_79.pdf

My favorite doctrinal conundrum

Example 1. In 1835, 56:3,5 read:
"Jehovah saw his darling Son"; 56:5:

"This is my Son, Jehovah cries"; and 3:4: "The name of Jehovah is worthy of praising,/ And so is the Savior an excellent theme." These 1835 hymns suggested that Jesus was Jehovah's son. In current LDS doctrine, however, Jesus is Jehovah himself.

[_Stormy Waters]

http://mormonmatters.org/2012/10/28/135-136-racism-and-the-book-of-mormon/

For those who may be interested Brain Dalton participated in a Mormon Matters podcast on this topic.

[_Mary]

http://mormonmatters.org/2012/10/28/135-136-racism-and-the-book-of-mormon/

For those who may be interested Brain Dalton participated in a Mormon Matters podcast on this topic.

Thankyou.

Someone over on Facebook has also just posted links to this documentary made by a young Navajo man about the effect of Book of Mormon teachings on his people and on Polynesians. It is very gentle, honest and non-confrontational and has all the more impact because of it.

Worth watching.

http://www.cultureunplugged.com/play/15 ... e-Identity

[_why me]

It is very gentle, honest and non-confrontational and has all the more impact because of it.

Worth watching.

http://www.cultureunplugged.com/play/15 ... e-Identity

Non-confrontational? Really? He guy films Mormon missionaries in secret and films a LDS institute in secret and asks questions from the people as if they were not being filmed and you call this honest? And of course, the people who are against the church are filmed normally in full view and not in secret. Wonderful and honest. The film is rather slanted against the Mormons but if you think that it is an honest film and gentle....well what can I say? And what about the woman at the end? Wonderful...interview...she hates christians in general. Wonderful bigoted woman.

Have you seen Mel Gibson's film ''apocalypto"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apocalypto

Quite a film about the 'lamanites'. Don't you think?