the dead

[Guest]

If how to decrease this violence is not a Christian and Mormon topic. Then what relationship do Christian or LDS concepts have to life?

not off topic, unless life is off topic.

maybe it is.

[_why me]

This message board is a waste of time,

Let us look at it this way: many people have anger toward Mormonism. So, they need this forum to express their anger and read more anger so they can get over their anger. Anger feeding anger means no more anger. Just look at exmo and postmo. The same reasoning applies. What did we do years ago before the internet and before all the violence...we watched Hazel or the Mary Tyler Moore Show etc. And had a good laugh.

[_bcspace]

I do KNOW we need to get really strict on guns and change our culture. America has become an embarrassment to modernized nations.

Here is lostindc in a blue top arguing for gun control:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=84ptFVq22PY

[_MeDotOrg]

In 1982, a series of seemingly unrelated deaths in the Chicago area were united by a chilling fact: Each of the deaths had occurred after the victim used Tylenol. Someone had put massive amounts of potassium cyanide in Tylenol capsules and put them in bottles on the shelves of stores. It was a huge story. Stores emptied their shelves of Tylenol, Johnson & Johnson spent millions on a recall.

In the months following the Tylenol killings, the FDA tracked 270 incidents of copy-cat product tampering from rat poison to hydrochloric acid.

No one has ever been prosecuted for the Tylenol murders.

The result of all of this are the little inconveniences we live with today: Plastic sleeves around and foil seals over the tops of bottles, A simple and effective solution. The problem has virtually disappeared.

I started thinking about the Tylenol murders when I was reading this thread. The thing that made be uncomfortable was the 270 copy-cat incidences after the original killings were publicized. These are just the people who ACTED. How many other people THOUGHT about acting? How many people would kill if there were no consequences, no way of getting caught?

The are no protective sleeves or foil seals to protect us from gun violence.

There are other countries where firearms are prevalent, although arguably no other country where private gun ownership is an inextricable thread of the country's fabric for many of its citizens. But among settled Western Democracies, the Unites States stands alone. Our gun homicide rate is 69 times higher than great Britain.

Guns are not alone the problem. They are a part of the crazy cocktail of the American Experience and the American mythos: Each man is an island. The individual above all else.

Freedom, baby. Read it and weep.

After Columbine, after Virginia Tech, after Aurora, after Oak Creek Sikh Temple, and now after Sandy Hook, people will say: now is not the time to discuss gun control. Wait until passions subside. When these events occur so frequently that they become a part of each news cycle, will it then be time to discuss gun control?

The fact is that we have a problem with gun violence in this country. America is very good at allowing people to become rich. It is very good at allowing people individual freedom. But can one's citizens right to bear arms infringe upon another citizens's life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness?

Ours is a country where freedom and fear live side by side.

[_Philidel]

In 1982, a series of seemingly unrelated deaths in the Chicago area were united by a chilling fact: Each of the deaths had occurred after the victim used Tylenol. Someone had put massive amounts of potassium cyanide in Tylenol capsules and put them in bottles on the shelves of stores. It was a huge story. Stores emptied their shelves of Tylenol, Johnson & Johnson spent millions on a recall.

In the months following the Tylenol killings, the FDA tracked 270 incidents of copy-cat product tampering from rat poison to hydrochloric acid.

No one has ever been prosecuted for the Tylenol murders.

The result of all of this are the little inconveniences we live with today: Plastic sleeves around and foil seals over the tops of bottles, A simple and effective solution. The problem has virtually disappeared.

I started thinking about the Tylenol murders when I was reading this thread. The thing that made be uncomfortable was the 270 copy-cat incidences after the original killings were publicized. These are just the people who ACTED. How many other people THOUGHT about acting? How many people would kill if there were no consequences, no way of getting caught?

The are no protective sleeves or foil seals to protect us from gun violence.

There are other countries where firearms are prevalent, although arguably no other country where private gun ownership is an inextricable thread of the country's fabric for many of its citizens. But among settled Western Democracies, the Unites States stands alone. Our gun homicide rate is 69 times higher than great Britain.

Guns are not alone the problem. They are a part of the crazy cocktail of the American Experience and the American mythos: Each man is an island. The individual above all else.

Freedom, baby. Read it and weep.

After Columbine, after Virginia Tech, after Aurora, after Oak Creek Sikh Temple, and now after Sandy Hook, people will say: now is not the time to discuss gun control. Wait until passions subside. When these events occur so frequently that they become a part of each news cycle, will it then be time to discuss gun control?

The fact is that we have a problem with gun violence in this country. America is very good at allowing people to become rich. It is very good at allowing people individual freedom. But can one's citizens right to bear arms infringe upon another citizens's life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness?

Ours is a country where freedom and fear live side by side.

Well said. Worth re-reading.

I don't know how America will fix its dysfunctional culture. I was 12 when Kennedy was shot, then there was Whitman on the U Texas tower -- I was 15 -- then Bobby Kennedy and Martin Luther King -- 16 -- and how many other shootings of private citizens since then? My point, I grew up with this culture of shootings of public and private citizens. And the country is so dysfunctional that it gets worse, not better, and there is no common-sense-based dialogue. Nor is there any real expectation there will be change in the wake of this one.

I had the opportunity to leave America and live elsewhere; I took it gladly. It didn't take this outrage to affirm my choice; it is reaffirmed for a variety of reasons daily. However, this shooting and the many like it over the past several years -- so many we lose track of them -- is symptomatic of some of the reasons why I left. I am glad I will never again live in America.

[_beastie]

People like what?

People under age 25? People with any form of mental illness from anxiety to depression to bipolar disorder? Should there be a mandatory mental health screening (done under lie detector testing) in order to be approved for a gun license? People that are men? Or perhaps anyone with any type of disability should be barred from keeping a firearm.

I'm a fan of tighter restrictions on guns, but I think we should think long and hard before we start to selectively discriminate against certain populations.

My son has bipolar and he is 100% supportive of not allowing people with mental illness to own guns. Of course he's stable and sane now, thanks to medication, which is why he is able to make such a judgment about his condition before stability and why having a gun in his hands would have been an extraordinarily bad idea.

Did you know that if you report having a mental illness like bipolar to the DMV in some states, like mine, your physician has to fill out a report every year or two years asserting that there's no reason you should not be able to drive a vehicle? And yet people with serious mental illnesses can buy a gun? So why not, at the least, require a physician to regularly fill out such a form before someone with a mental illness can legally possess a firearm? (apparently some states already have such a regulation, but why not all states?)

I guess that there isn't a powerful enough "drivers" lobby donating buttloads of money to prostituted politicians.

Even more important, in my mind, is ensuring that there is adequate medical care available for the mentally ill. Not that our country ever excelled at that, but many states have enacted cut-backs that have impacted the ability of the mentally ill to get adequate care.

[_lostindc]

I do KNOW we need to get really strict on guns and change our culture. America has become an embarrassment to modernized nations.

Here is lostindc in a blue top arguing for gun control:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=84ptFVq22PY

lol @ bcspace. I have always been fascinated by those so in favor of guns. They always tend to be the weaker of society. Why not learn to fight with your body if you want to prove how tough you are? I have an open space in my muay thai class if you are ever in the area.

[_huckelberry]

Let us look at it this way: many people have anger toward Mormonism. So, they need this forum

Why me, I suffered from a passing snit, sorry. I have found a significant number of discussions on this board with worthwhile subjects and thoughts. Perhaps not all but enough to add up to many.

[_just me]

People like what?

People under age 25? People with any form of mental illness from anxiety to depression to bipolar disorder? Should there be a mandatory mental health screening (done under lie detector testing) in order to be approved for a gun license? People that are men? Or perhaps anyone with any type of disability should be barred from keeping a firearm.

I'm a fan of tighter restrictions on guns, but I think we should think long and hard before we start to selectively discriminate against certain populations.

My son has bipolar and he is 100% supportive of not allowing people with mental illness to own guns. Of course he's stable and sane now, thanks to medication, which is why he is able to make such a judgment about his condition before stability and why having a gun in his hands would have been an extraordinarily bad idea.

Did you know that if you report having a mental illness like bipolar to the DMV in some states, like mine, your physician has to fill out a report every year or two years asserting that there's no reason you should not be able to drive a vehicle? And yet people with serious mental illnesses can buy a gun? So why not, at the least, require a physician to regularly fill out such a form before someone with a mental illness can legally possess a firearm? (apparently some states already have such a regulation, but why not all states?)

I guess that there isn't a powerful enough "drivers" lobby donating buttloads of money to prostituted politicians.

Even more important, in my mind, is ensuring that there is adequate medical care available for the mentally ill. Not that our country ever excelled at that, but many states have enacted cut-backs that have impacted the ability of the mentally ill to get adequate care.

That's just the thing. You can't rent a car until you are 25, yet all these people under 25 seem to be able to get their hands on guns.

Some mental illnesses don't set in until early 20s. So many people never see a doctor for their mental illness. Depression can happen at any time. Someone can be fine and then through different factors have depression. Should we, and how could we, keep guns out of the hands of the depressed?

Plus, we have to look at the millions of depressed and otherwise mentally ill who never once harm another individual.

This is why I am for stricter gun control that does not discriminate against any particular group or groups. Well, I am fine with an age requirement...so I guess I am ageist.

[_beastie]

That's just the thing. You can't rent a car until you are 25, yet all these people under 25 seem to be able to get their hands on guns.

Some mental illnesses don't set in until early 20s. So many people never see a doctor for their mental illness. Depression can happen at any time. Someone can be fine and then through different factors have depression. Should we, and how could we, keep guns out of the hands of the depressed?

Plus, we have to look at the millions of depressed and otherwise mentally ill who never once harm another individual.

This is why I am for stricter gun control that does not discriminate against any particular group or groups. Well, I am fine with an age requirement...so I guess I am ageist.

Just because we can't hope to implement a law with perfect results doesn't mean that implementing said law wouldn't ameloriate the situation to some extent. We can't just not try because it's not a perfect solution. Maybe several imperfect solutions can have a cumulative positive effect.