Animal sacrifice in New Testament era LDS teach

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_Tobin
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Re: Animal sacrifice in New Testament era LDS teach

Post by _Tobin »

Albion wrote:I understand what you are saying but prophesy has no value in and of itself...there has to be purpose in the act...what is the purpose of this future act of sacrifice?


What was the purpose of destroying the best of your flocks and harvest in the Old Testament? Seems like a waste to me. It was done because it was the will of the Lord, and that is all this is as well.
"You lack vision, but I see a place where people get on and off the freeway. On and off, off and on all day, all night.... Tire salons, automobile dealerships and wonderful, wonderful billboards reaching as far as the eye can see. My God, it'll be beautiful." -- Judge Doom
_Albion
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Re: Animal sacrifice in New Testament era LDS teach

Post by _Albion »

But there was purpose in the Old Testament accounts. Animal sacrifice in the Old Testament was for forgiveness of sin and a blessing from God by the demonstration of putting him first above all things. Since Mormons believe in a sacrifice yet to be made by Levi's sons (the priestly line of descent) what do they say is its purpose? My dictionary lists the meaning of the word sacrifice as: "...the practice or act of killing an animal or person or surrendering a possession as an offering to deity: an animal, person, or object offered in this way; an act of giving up something of value for the sake of something that is of greater value or importance." Concise OED. That's all I'm getting at and it's perfectly okay to say you don 't know.
_Tobin
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Re: Animal sacrifice in New Testament era LDS teach

Post by _Tobin »

I really fail to see how sins were forgiven/or it was a blessing by burning up the best stuff you had at the time. I think my characterization is probably more accurate of it. It was simply the will of the Lord (most likely a test since that tends to be how the Lord operates). As far as why the sons of Levi must offer a sacrifice. Again, it is as I stated - it is the will of the Lord and so it will be done. If you are interested in anything more specific than that, I don't know is perfectly fine with me - go ask God.
"You lack vision, but I see a place where people get on and off the freeway. On and off, off and on all day, all night.... Tire salons, automobile dealerships and wonderful, wonderful billboards reaching as far as the eye can see. My God, it'll be beautiful." -- Judge Doom
_subgenius
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Re: Animal sacrifice in New Testament era LDS teach

Post by _subgenius »

Albion wrote:I would still like an answer to my original question. What would the purpose be for such a future sacrifice of an animal? Are you saying atonement for sin? Demonstration of faith...what exactly? I have no specific view on this but want the Mormon reasoning.

the Book of Hebrews explains that Cain and Abel provided sacrifices that were sufficient and insufficient based on faith alone.
I believe you will find that Paul echoes this sentiment further in Romans.
You will find that animal sacrifice is considered still necessary by Orthodox Jews (see also Yom Kippur) - yet they recognize they are only to be offered when and where God commands - and they do not consider the Old Testament sacrifices as being an indication of the coming Messiah.
Just as with the Jewish tradition, animal sacrifice is not intended to be carried out by just anyone at anytime.
I consider the Old Testament origins of animal sacrifice to be relevant in as much as they were instituted to represent the gods of Egypt - just as we learn that the plagues sent upon Egypt were specifically against Egyptian gods.
In as much as these events represent the bondage and freedom of Israel it is not a stretch to apply them to the future, or to discern them as a manner by which God works on this earth.

So, is future animal sacrifice to be a necessary blood atonement for Adam's sin - i don't think so, since we recognize that debt paid. But since animal sacrifice has been implemented by the Lord at different times for different reasons, it is not an absurd prophecy.
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_subgenius
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Re: Animal sacrifice in New Testament era LDS teach

Post by _subgenius »

Tobin wrote:I really fail to see how sins were forgiven/or it was a blessing by burning up the best stuff you had at the time.

in the context of it being an expression of obedience and an expression of sacrifice.
First obedience to God's command and then forsaking your own "stuff"..things you had created or gained possession of, etc...especially since burnt offerings were intended to be a complete eradication, there were no parts saved for a priest or another to eat, so there would be no satisfaction of it fulfilling an iota of earthly purpose.
Seek freedom and become captive of your desires...seek discipline and find your liberty
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_Tobin
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Re: Animal sacrifice in New Testament era LDS teach

Post by _Tobin »

subgenius wrote:
Tobin wrote:I really fail to see how sins were forgiven/or it was a blessing by burning up the best stuff you had at the time.

in the context of it being an expression of obedience and an expression of sacrifice.
First obedience to God's command and then forsaking your own "stuff"..things you had created or gained possession of, etc...especially since burnt offerings were intended to be a complete eradication, there were no parts saved for a priest or another to eat, so there would be no satisfaction of it fulfilling an iota of earthly purpose.

Oh, I understand that need to follow the will of the Lord and doing so is ultimately in your best interest. However, the act itself here is of little merit. Stuff is destroyed and that's all there is to it. Nothing magical going on here at all.
"You lack vision, but I see a place where people get on and off the freeway. On and off, off and on all day, all night.... Tire salons, automobile dealerships and wonderful, wonderful billboards reaching as far as the eye can see. My God, it'll be beautiful." -- Judge Doom
_just me
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Re: Animal sacrifice in New Testament era LDS teach

Post by _just me »

I thought the sacrifices were eaten.
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_Morley
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Re: Animal sacrifice in New Testament era LDS teach

Post by _Morley »

subgenius wrote:You will find that animal sacrifice is considered still necessary by Orthodox Jews (see also Yom Kippur) - yet they recognize they are only to be offered when and where God commands - and they do not consider the Old Testament sacrifices as being an indication of the coming Messiah.
Just as with the Jewish tradition, animal sacrifice is not intended to be carried out by just anyone at anytime.
I consider the Old Testament origins of animal sacrifice to be relevant in as much as they were instituted to represent the gods of Egypt - just as we learn that the plagues sent upon Egypt were specifically against Egyptian gods.
In as much as these events represent the bondage and freedom of Israel it is not a stretch to apply them to the future, or to discern them as a manner by which God works on this earth.


Your representation of Judaism is tragically flawed, to say the least.
_Morley
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Re: Animal sacrifice in New Testament era LDS teach

Post by _Morley »

just me wrote:I thought the sacrifices were eaten.


As usual, you're right. Many were, depending on the type of sacrifice.
_subgenius
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Re: Animal sacrifice in New Testament era LDS teach

Post by _subgenius »

just me wrote:I thought the sacrifices were eaten.

not burnt offerings, or "Olah"...no part is eaten by anyone.
Seek freedom and become captive of your desires...seek discipline and find your liberty
I can tell if a person is judgmental just by looking at them
what is chaos to the fly is normal to the spider - morticia addams
If you're not upsetting idiots, you might be an idiot. - Ted Nugent
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