Possible Modern Source for the Book of Mormon

[_Ceeboo]

Why don't they just add The Late War to the quad?

Problem solved!



Peace,
Ceeboo

[Guest]

It pains me to respond to this since there is obviously nothing substantive in this post either.

Candidly, it pains all of us when people respond to Tobin (who I am sure is a very sincere and nice fellow...sometimes). Resist.

It must be such a burden for you and others here to actually have to answer questions about the nonsense many of you post and to actually have to think about what you say. You MIGHT even have to consider a different point of view and make an argument to support your own views. So, I'm sure it is much easier for you to bury your head in the sand.

[_Tim the Enchanter]

Hi Tim,

I did a little snooping around the Good Book looking for the words "trench", "ditch", "parapet", and "picket" and I didn't find much of interest. Again, we have some real scripture scholars around here who could easily point out deficiencies in my research, but I'm optimistic for now. I believe much of the war described in earlier times is of the Israelites attacking the cities of other nations rather than bunkering up and protecting themselves. I looked for descriptions of Jerusalem being attacked with similar results and came up empty. So the attack on Fort Stephenson is very similar to Alma 49 and 50, and tentatively, I'm going to say the similarity isn't shared with the Bible. Hunt alludes to David and Goliath, and I'm thinking that if there had been a more direct connection to a similar Bible war, Hunt would have surely used it.

I'm Wondering if the "102 score" (exaggerated) lost by the King of England and the 7 wounded Americans kept the numbers reported of 1000 lost by the Lamanite King and 50 wounded of the Nephites more honest than the epic battles of the Jaradites. ;)

I share your optimism. :-) Though I quoted only a few verses of Late War XXIX, the whole chapter reads just like a war chapters in Alma. Of the little of Late War I have thus explored, this chapter resonated with me the most probably because I have always been fond of the war chapters in the Book of Mormon. In fact, Alma 49 is my favorite chapters in the Book of Mormon (which, by itself, may make me odd considering this is one of the least quoted or referenced chapters in the Book of Mormon). I've probably read Alma 49 more than any other chapter in the Book of Mormon, which is why, when reading Late War XXIX, it sounded so familiar.

[_Fence Sitter]

Why don't they just add The Late War to the quad?

Problem solved!



Peace,
Ceeboo

Wouldn't it be a quint then?

[_Ceeboo]

Why don't they just add The Late War to the quad?

Problem solved!



Peace,
Ceeboo

Wouldn't it be a quint then?

Yes, I suppose it would!

Peace,
Ceeboo

[_Equality]

[You MIGHT even have to consider a different point of view and make an argument to support your own views. So, I'm sure it is much easier for you to bury your head in the sand.

A nominee for most ironic post of the year, no?

[_Gadianton]

Tim,

As a scholar of those two chapters, perhaps you could share your thoughts on a couple things. The Lamanite captains head for city 1, see that it's fortified, and move on to city 2, which Moroni had bet on since it was a weaker city. But lo, city 2 had been fortified too, and not only that, but the great "Lehi" was in charge. They ran scared from city 1 so how to get them to engage city 2 of similar strength? Apparently, it's a matter of ruthless Lamanite honesty, they swore an oath to attack it, so now they were committed. The Lamanite captains stepped up commander Proctor's rash decision making into outright irrationality, having no counter-fort strategy or technology apparently at all. No scaling ladders or specialized tools for bringing down the ridge. Post chapter 50, if they were to attack, they'd also need axes to cut the pickets. A lot of fast-moving technology for the Nephites it seems. The real death toll stopped for Proctor at around 50 dead before fleeing into the forest (Late War says 2000+?), but the Lamanites just threw themselves at a fortified ridge having no known means for assailing one, until 1000 were dead, and then retreated into the wilderness.

Well, just wondering, if you see a deeper rationality to the Lamanite actions here, and also curious if fortifications of this kind were new to the Book of Mormon or if they knew about them but just had never used before. Moroni seemed to have no issues erecting dirt walls around every Nephite city with full palisade walls on top of that, and then guard towers. Seems expensive, and also somewhat irrational given the Lamanites had no known means of penetrating the basic parapet and trench. curious about your thoughts on this.

[_Tobin]

[You MIGHT even have to consider a different point of view and make an argument to support your own views. So, I'm sure it is much easier for you to bury your head in the sand.

A nominee for most ironic post of the year, no?

There is nothing ironic about my post. It is just a sad commentary on the nature of many of those that post here. All I see the critics do here is encourage others to not engage with ideas, but instead advocate ignoring them and refraining from any discussion. There are several posts to that effect, in direct reference to me and my views, in this thread alone.

[_Gadianton]

I think many critics wrongly think Craig's hypothesis excludes Joseph as an author.

Some of us just don't have the detective interests to follow the Spalding Theory. I've never had much interest in any Book of Mormon origin theories. So there is some real ignorance there on my part. I'm actually more interested in Craig's work after learning of the Late War. It's fascinating that his study finds Spaulding breaking the needle in Alma, right where Late War rises to the surface. Not sure what to make of it, but it has my attention. If it weren't for the thematic rewards of Late War, however, my interest would be passing.

[_Polygamy-Porter]

This new find. Wow!

Plus other books and works that Smith read and had access to:
- View of the Hebrews
- Manuscript Found
- Bible with Isaiah verse for verse in the Book of Mormon, complete with King James translation errors
- Bible and the similarities of Book of Moses to Genesis
- Swedenborg's Heaven and Hell(origins of three degrees of glory)
- Sylvester Graham and his work that lead to the Temperance Society movement(Word of Wisdom origins)
- FreeMasonry: Smith's involvement, first polygamist wife was widow of Captain William Morgan who was killed for authoring a detailed expose on FreeMasonry and their temple ceremonies(LDS Temple ceremony origins)


What will all of this mean to the chapel Mormons?

Likely not much. Most are too busy being good busy body Mormon sheep to read about the religion forced upon them by their parents and leaders of their youth.

Will mo'pologists come up with even more ridiculous "plausible" explanations? OMG yes! Their mo'pologetic egos cannot grow without crapping out giant steaming plausible turds.

Will this new information cause the cancer of disenchantment continue to kill tithe paying testimonies? Oh hell yeah.