Bible verse by verse

[_huckelberry]

I have been a little puzzled by the obsessive demand Nipper prove God.

Then you really haven't been paying attention.

After all everybody knows there is no proof of God.

Do you think, based on this thread, that Little Nipper accepts there is no proof of God?

Bazooka, I may have to ask your pardon. I used your question as a rhetorical stepping stone. I do not wish to stop you from pursuing your question. As far as proofs, Nippers is unusual. It doesn't seem to track quite right to my mind.

[_The Erotic Apologist]

Huckleberry--

Just so we're clear, I didn't mean for this image (below) to be an insult, implied or otherwise. I just thought it was funny. To my mind, you're one of the more level-headed believers in this whole forum.

[_Bazooka]

Bazooka, I may have to ask your pardon. I used your question as a rhetorical stepping stone. I do not wish to stop you from pursuing your question. As far as proofs, Nippers is unusual. It doesn't seem to track quite right to my mind.

You have no need to ask, it is freely given.
I'm a blunt and ascerbic sob when the moons in a certain phase. Plus I like a good sharp cut and thrust as much if not more than the next man. Not so good for the diplomatic corps great for interviewing resistent or reluctant interviewee's.

[_Gunnar]

The Bible is God's Word. The Bible is perfect. Jesus Christ is the God's Son. The Messiah is perfect. Man is not perfect. The Bible is perfect and therefore there is a God or the Bible could not exist because it is perfect. Religions that consider the Bible as imperfect are only attempting to uplift their own imperfection to a higher level.

What is the essential difference between that response and closing your eyes, sticking your fingers in your ears and saying "I can't hear you?" Do you realize how desperate and helpless you sound when you have no remaining recourse but to repeat that mantra?

[Guest]

The Bible is God's Word. The Bible is perfect. Jesus Christ is the God's Son. The Messiah is perfect. Man is not perfect. The Bible is perfect and therefore there is a God or the Bible could not exist because it is perfect. Religions that consider the Bible as imperfect are only attempting to uplift their own imperfection to a higher level.

What is the essential difference between that response and closing your eyes, sticking your fingers in your ears and saying "I can't hear you?" Do you realize how desperate and helpless you sound when you have no remaining recourse but to repeat that mantra?

And what is the difference with your own responses and not having one clue how to create life from rocks, minerals and water no matter how hard you try ---- you cannot prove the Bible is wrong. You can only imagine how it doesn't fit your expectations of reality. So, I would suggest that you remove your thumb from the end of your nose and stop wiggling your fingers.

[_LittleNipper]

Joshua 13:1-33 Joshua's body had become old. Lord said to him, that there were still many nations to be conquered. Following is the list of areas still to be occupied:

All the land of the Philistines;

The land of the Geshurites;

The territory now belonging to the Canaanites from the brook of Egypt to the southern boundary of Ekron;

Five cities of the Philistines: Gaza, Ashdod, Ashkelon, Gath, Ekron;

The land of the Avvim in the south;

In the north, all the land of the Canaanites, including Mearah (which belongs to the Sidonians), stretching northward to Aphek at the boundary of the Amorites;

The land of the Gebalites on the coast* and all of the Lebanon mountain area from Baal-gad beneath Mount Hermon in the south to the entrance of Hamath in the north;

All the hill country from Lebanon to Misrephoth-maim, including all the land of the Sidonians.

God is ready to drive these people out from before the nation of Israel, so all this territory is to be included when the land is divided among the nine tribes and the half-tribe of Manasseh. The other half of the tribe of Manasseh and the tribes of Reuben and Gad had already received their inheritance on the east side of the Jordan, for Moses had previously assigned this land to them. Their territory ran from Aroer, on the edge of the valley of the Arnon River, included the city in the valley, and crossed the tableland of Medeba to Dibon; including all the cities of King Sihon of the Amorites, who reigned in Heshbon, and extended as far as the borders of Ammon. It included Gilead; the territory of the Geshurites and the Maacathites; all of Mount Hermon; Mount Bashan with its city of Salecah; and all the territory of King Og of Bashan, who had reigned in Ashtaroth and Edrei. (He was the last of the Rephaim, for Moses had attacked them and driven them out. However, the people of Israel had not driven out the Geshurites or the Maacathites, who still live there among the Israelites to the day this record was written.

Moses hadn’t assigned any land to the tribe of Levi: instead, they were given the offerings brought to the Lord. The Land Given to the Tribe of Reuben: Fitting the size of its territory to the size of its population, Moses had assigned the following area to the tribe of Reuben: Their land extended from Aroer on the edge of the valley of the Arnon River, past the city of Arnon in the middle of the valley, to beyond the tableland near Medeba. It included Heshbon and the other cities on the plain—Dibon, Bamoth-baal, Beth-baal-meon, Jahaz, Kedemoth, Mephaath, Kiriathaim, Sibmah, Zereth-shahar on the mountain above the valley, Beth-peor, Beth-jeshimoth, and the slopes of Mount Pisgah. The land of Reuben also included the cities of the tableland and the kingdom of Sihon. Sihon was the king who had lived in Heshbon and was killed by Moses along with the other chiefs of Midian—Evi, Rekem, Zur, Hur, and Reba. 22 The people of Israel also killed Balaam the magician, the son of Beor. The Jordan River was the western boundary of the tribe of Reuben.

Moses also assigned land to the tribe of Gad in proportion to its population. This territory included Jazer, all the cities of Gilead, and half of the land of Ammon as far as Aroer near Rabbah. It also extended from Heshbon to Ramath-mizpeh and Betonim, and from Mahanaim to Lodebar. In the valley were Beth-haram, and Beth-nimrah, Succoth, Zaphon, and the rest of the kingdom of King Sihon of Heshbon. The Jordan River was the western border, extending as far as the Lake of Galilee; then the border turned east from the Jordan River.

Moses had assigned the following territory to the half-tribe of Manasseh in proportion to its needs: Their territory extended north from Mahanaim, included all of Bashan, the former kingdom of King Og, and the sixty cities of Jair in Bashan. Half of Gilead and King Og’s royal cities of Ashtaroth and Edrei were given to half of the clan Machir, who was Manasseh’s son. That was how Moses divided the land east of the Jordan River where the people were camped at that time across from Jericho.


Young's Literal Translation (YLT)


1 And Joshua is old, entering into days, and Jehovah saith unto him, `Thou hast become aged, thou hast entered into days; as to the land, very much hath been left to possess.

2 `This [is] the land that is left; all the circuits of the Philistines, and all Geshuri,

3 from Sihor which [is] on the front of Egypt, and unto the border of Ekron northward, to the Canaanite it is reckoned, five princes of the Philistines, the Gazathite, and the Ashdothite, the Eshkalonite, the Gittite, and the Ekronite, also the Avim.

4 `From the south, all the land of the Canaanite, and Mearah, which [is] to the Sidonians, unto Aphek, unto the border of the Amorite;

5 and the land of the Giblite, and all Lebanon, at the sun-rising, from Baal-Gad under mount Hermon, unto the going in to Hamath:

6 all the inhabitants of the hill-country, from Lebanon unto Misrephoth-Maim, all the Sidonians: I -- I dispossess them before the sons of Israel; only, cause it to fall to Israel for an inheritance, as I have commanded thee.

7 `And now, apportion this land for an inheritance to the nine tribes, and the half of the tribe of Manasseh,' --

8 with it the Reubenite, and the Gadite, have received their inheritance, which Moses hath given to them beyond the Jordan eastward, as Moses servant of Jehovah hath given to them;

9 from Aroer, which [is] on the edge of the brook Arnon, and the city which [is] in the midst of the brook, and all the plain of Medeba unto Dihon,

10 and all the cities of Sihon king of the Amorite, who reigned in Heshbon, unto the border of the Bene-Ammon,

11 and Gilead, and the border of the Geshurite, and of the Maachathite, and all mount Hermon, and all Bashan unto Salcah;

12 all the kingdom of Og in Bashan, who reigned in Ashtaroth and in Edrei; he was left of the remnant of the Rephaim, and Moses doth smite them, and dispossess them;

13 and the sons of Israel dispossessed not the Geshurite, and the Maachathite; and Geshur and Maachath dwell in the midst of Israel unto this day.

14 Only, to the tribe of Levi he hath not given an inheritance; fire-offerings of Jehovah, God of Israel, is its inheritance, as He hath spoken to it.

15 And Moses giveth to the tribe of the sons of Reuben, for their families;

16 and the border is to them from Aroer, which [is] on the edge of the brook Arnon, and the city which [is] in the midst of the brook, and all the plain by Medeba,

17 Heshbon, and all its cities which [are] in the plain, Dibon, and Bamoth-Baal, and Beth-Baal-Meon,

18 and Jahazah, and Kedemoth, and Mephaath,

19 and Kirjathaim, and Sibmah, and Zareth-Shahar, in the mount of the valley,

20 and Beth-Peor, and the springs of Pisgah, and Beth-Jeshimoth,

21 and all the cities of the plain, and all the kingdom of Sihon king of the Amorite, who reigned in Heshbon, whom Moses smote, with the princes of Midian, Evi, and Rekem, and Zur, and Hur, and Reba, princes of Sihon, inhabitants of the land.

22 And Balaam, son of Beor, the diviner, have the sons of Israel slain with the sword, among their wounded ones.

23 And the border of the sons of Reuben is the Jordan, and [its] border; this [is] the inheritance of the sons of Reuben, for their families, the cities and their villages.

24 And Moses giveth to the tribe of Gad, to the sons of Gad, for their families;

25 and the border is to them Jazer, and all the cities of Gilead, and the half of the land of the Bene-Ammon, unto Aroer which [is] on the front of Rabbah,

26 and from Heshbon unto Ramath-Mispeh, and Betonim, and from Mahanaim unto the border of Debir,

27 and in the valley, Beth-Aram, and Beth-Nimrah, and Succoth, and Zaphon, the rest of the kingdom of Sihon king of Heshbon, the Jordan and [its] border, unto the extremity of the sea of Chinnereth, beyond the Jordan, eastward.

28 This [is] the inheritance of the sons of Gad, for their families, the cities and their villages.

29 And Moses giveth to the half of the tribe of Manasseh; and it is to the half of the tribe of the sons of Manasseh, for their families.

30 And their border is from Mahanaim, all Bashan, all the kingdom of Og king of Bashan, and all the small towns of Jair, which [are] in Bashan, sixty cities;

31 and the half of Gilead, and Ashteroth, and Edrei, cities of the kingdom of Og in Bashan, [are] to the sons of Machir, son of Manasseh, to the half of the sons of Machir, for their families.

32 These [are] they whom Moses caused to inherit in the plains of Moab, beyond the Jordan, [by] Jericho, eastward;

33 and to the tribe of Levi Moses gave not an inheritance; Jehovah, God of Israel, Himself [is] their inheritance, as He hath spoken to them.

[_The Erotic Apologist]

And what is the difference with your own responses and not having one clue how to create life from rocks, minerals and water no matter how hard you try...

Through the processes of digestion, respiration, metabolism, and reproduction my wife and I transformed substances grown from rocks and minerals (and other biological matter) into another, smaller Erotic Apologist.

Creating him was the easy part. Raising him is a bit more difficult.

Where specifically does the god of the Bible come into the process?

...you cannot prove the Bible is wrong.

Many parts of the Bible can very easily be proven wrong, while other parts can't. The same is true for the Qur'an, for Dianetics, and many other religious texts. What makes your mythology better than everyone else's?

You can only imagine how it doesn't fit your expectations of reality.

The Bible describes a reality filled with dramatic, robust, and extravagant supernatural phenomena. The supernatural world of the Bible in no way resembles the world I live in.

I suspect it doesn't resemble the world you live in, either.

[_ludwigm]

I'm a blunt and ascerbic sob when the moons in a certain phase.

Near full moon, ehm...

Download and use MOONTOOL (link) ! (old vindoze 3.0 ...)

.

[_Gunnar]

You can only imagine how it doesn't fit your expectations of reality.

My expectations of reality are irrelevant. It is my perceptions of reality that count, and they too often do not match what a literal reading of the Bible would lead me to expect. EA is dead right. There are many parts of the Bible that are quite easy to disprove and have, in fact, been disproved. That there also happen to be parts of the Bible that have not been and probably can't be disproved cannot justify the claim that it is inerrant when there are so many parts of it that are demonstrably erroneous and/or contradict other parts of the Bible.

You are, in a way, doing us all a favor by this thread you started, because the Bible has had such a profound cultural effect, especially on Western Civilization, that no one in our society who is entirely unfamiliar with it can be regarded as adequately educated. The biggest favor you are doing us, however, is that every truly reasonable and honest person who actually reads all your quotes from the Bible cannot fail to perceive just how flawed that book is! I believe it is the ex-evangelist Dan Barker who once said something like "nothing will turn you into an atheist faster than reading the Bible from cover to cover." I would venture to guess that of those who are still reading and following your efforts to expose us all to the entirety of the Bible, more of them are turned off by your efforts than being converted to your extreme point of view.

The more I learn about history, science, culture and the Bible, the more inescapable becomes the conclusion that the Bible contains both history and mythology, both truth and fiction, both sense and nonsense, and that it is at least as unreasonable and wrong to conclude it is infallible and inerrant as it is to conclude that it contains nothing at all that is relevant or valuable.

[_Bazooka]

The Bible is perfect and therefore there is a God or the Bible could not exist because it is perfect.

The Book of Mormon is perfect and therefore there is a God or The Book of Mormon could not exist because it is perfect.
The Quran is perfect and therefore there is a God or the Quran could not exist because it is perfect.