The Top Ten Happenings in Mopologetics, 2014

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_Doctor Scratch
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Re: The Top Ten Happenings in Mopologetics, 2014

Post by _Doctor Scratch »

Mayan Elephant wrote:Scratch,

Thanks for the list. i enjoyed that.

i am curious how you ranked or considered the recent events and announcement of a new apologetics effort from yet another BYU professor, mr. hancock.

this enterprise, which might be called “moral apologetics” or perhaps “anti-ideological apologetics.”


https://ldsmag.com/meridian-expands-to- ... al-issues/


It'll be worth watching, I suppose, but I'm not holding out much hope for this. The Hon. Rev. Kishkumen once referred to Hancock as a "Doink," and it's becoming increasingly difficult to disagree with that characterization. It's hard not to laugh at how much he's hedging, and how much he's falling back on "politically correct" language--this in spite of all his talk about Standing Up For What's Right, and Being Courageous. He's making these vague allusions to "freedom" and "equality," but he seems unwilling to lay his chips on the table and say what he actually means. The reality is that he doesn't like gay people, doesn't want them to be equal to straight people, doesn't want them to be able to get married, and (probably) doesn't want them to be allowed to have sex. If he was legitimately "courageous," he'd just come right out and say this, but instead, you get this weirdly conspiratorial rhetoric from him, talking about how his career might be in jeopardy, etc. There's a pretty easy means of testing out his sincerity, though: ask him to name 10 gay couples that he personally knows, and ask him to lay out his arguments as specifically and explicitly as he possibly can. My prediction? It's never going to happen. The Mopologists will whine about this sort of thing off-the-record and on the L-Skinny list, but I'll be shocked if Meridian--or whatever the stupid name for this new venture is--comes out and actually addresses the issues head-on.

It's worth pointing out that, per the list, the defining Mopologetic moment of 2014 was "The Kingpin" of Mopologetics getting called a "coward"--in public, at the most important yearly gathering of Mopologists. That's devastating, and DCP himself hasn't really done anything to counter it, besides hand the baton off to Hamblin, who told the whole entire world about how his own BYU department ordered him to "cease and desist" with Mopologetics. "Mormon Scholars Testify" has been stagnant for ages; "The World Table," which we were told would "fundamentally change the way we interact online" was a complete, utterly humiliating failure; and now we are seeing overwhelming evidence of Mopologetic "cowardice"--everything from Hancock's limp-wristed hedging, to DCP getting squelched by Blair Hodges. It's worth pointing out that people like Hodges and David Bokovoy were--once upon a time--"proteges" of the Mopologists. What you're seeing is a case of the "Young Turks" turning on the Old Guard. Who's left to take over? Steve Smoot may be the only one, and he's very young--still an undergraduate, if I'm not mistaken. If he heads off to graduate school like Hodges did, who's to say what will happen? For a time it seemed like Bryce Haymond might have stepped up, but as far as I know, he was never even allowed to write anything, and now it seems like he might be out of the picture as well.

So, all things considered, I have to say that the future of Mopologetics doesn't look very bright. There is this repeated begging for money, with promises that "exciting" things are coming, but it really seems like a final withering on the vine.

Still, Happy Holidays!
"[I]f, while hoping that everybody else will be honest and so forth, I can personally prosper through unethical and immoral acts without being detected and without risk, why should I not?." --Daniel Peterson, 6/4/14
_Mayan Elephant
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Re: The Top Ten Happenings in Mopologetics, 2014

Post by _Mayan Elephant »

Doctor Scratch wrote:
It'll be worth watching, I suppose, but I'm not holding out much hope for this. The Hon. Rev. Kishkumen once referred to Hancock as a "Doink," and it's becoming increasingly difficult to disagree with that characterization. It's hard not to laugh at how much he's hedging, and how much he's falling back on "politically correct" language--this in spite of all his talk about Standing Up For What's Right, and Being Courageous. He's making these vague allusions to "freedom" and "equality," but he seems unwilling to lay his chips on the table and say what he actually means. The reality is that he doesn't like gay people, doesn't want them to be equal to straight people, doesn't want them to be able to get married, and (probably) doesn't want them to be allowed to have sex. If he was legitimately "courageous," he'd just come right out and say this, but instead, you get this weirdly conspiratorial rhetoric from him, talking about how his career might be in jeopardy, etc. There's a pretty easy means of testing out his sincerity, though: ask him to name 10 gay couples that he personally knows, and ask him to lay out his arguments as specifically and explicitly as he possibly can. My prediction? It's never going to happen. The Mopologists will whine about this sort of thing off-the-record and on the L-Skinny list, but I'll be shocked if Meridian--or whatever the stupid name for this new venture is--comes out and actually addresses the issues head-on.

It's worth pointing out that, per the list, the defining Mopologetic moment of 2014 was "The Kingpin" of Mopologetics getting called a "coward"--in public, at the most important yearly gathering of Mopologists. That's devastating, and DCP himself hasn't really done anything to counter it, besides hand the baton off to Hamblin, who told the whole entire world about how his own BYU department ordered him to "cease and desist" with Mopologetics. "Mormon Scholars Testify" has been stagnant for ages; "The World Table," which we were told would "fundamentally change the way we interact online" was a complete, utterly humiliating failure; and now we are seeing overwhelming evidence of Mopologetic "cowardice"--everything from Hancock's limp-wristed hedging, to DCP getting squelched by Blair Hodges. It's worth pointing out that people like Hodges and David Bokovoy were--once upon a time--"proteges" of the Mopologists. What you're seeing is a case of the "Young Turks" turning on the Old Guard. Who's left to take over? Steve Smoot may be the only one, and he's very young--still an undergraduate, if I'm not mistaken. If he heads off to graduate school like Hodges did, who's to say what will happen? For a time it seemed like Bryce Haymond might have stepped up, but as far as I know, he was never even allowed to write anything, and now it seems like he might be out of the picture as well.

So, all things considered, I have to say that the future of Mopologetics doesn't look very bright. There is this repeated begging for money, with promises that "exciting" things are coming, but it really seems like a final withering on the vine.

Still, Happy Holidays!


thanks!
"Rocks don't speak for themselves" is an unfortunate phrase to use in defense of a book produced by a rock actually 'speaking' for itself... (I have a Question, 5.15.15)
_Kishkumen
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Re: The Top Ten Happenings in Mopologetics, 2014

Post by _Kishkumen »

Kudos to Cassius U's own inimitable Dr. Scratch for another fine Top Ten. I would like to bring to his attention the Interpreter's significant coup of publishing Dr. Samuel Zinner's work on Enoch traditions. A non-LDS scholar, no less. Surely this demonstrates something of the vitality and growing reach of this relatively young classic-FARMS outlet.
"Petition wasn’t meant to start a witch hunt as I’ve said 6000 times." ~ Hanna Seariac, LDS apologist
_Doctor Scratch
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Re: The Top Ten Happenings in Mopologetics, 2014

Post by _Doctor Scratch »

Kishkumen wrote:Kudos to Cassius U's own inimitable Dr. Scratch for another fine Top Ten. I would like to bring to his attention the Interpreter's significant coup of publishing Dr. Samuel Zinner's work on Enoch traditions. A non-LDS scholar, no less. Surely this demonstrates something of the vitality and growing reach of this relatively young classic-FARMS outlet.


You're quite right, Reverend--this ought to have at least been an 'Honorable Mention'. Zinner is, without question, a sign of "vitality and growing reach":

Image
"[I]f, while hoping that everybody else will be honest and so forth, I can personally prosper through unethical and immoral acts without being detected and without risk, why should I not?." --Daniel Peterson, 6/4/14
_Everybody Wang Chung
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Re: The Top Ten Happenings in Mopologetics, 2014

Post by _Everybody Wang Chung »

Doctor Scratch wrote:
You're quite right, Reverend--this ought to have at least been an 'Honorable Mention'. Zinner is, without question, a sign of "vitality and growing reach":

Image



The funniest post I've read all week!
"I'm on paid sabbatical from BYU in exchange for my promise to use this time to finish two books."

Daniel C. Peterson, 2014
_Dr. Shades
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Re: The Top Ten Happenings in Mopologetics, 2014

Post by _Dr. Shades »

"Finally, for your rather strange idea that miracles are somehow linked to the amount of gay sexual gratification that is taking place would require that primitive Christianity was launched by gay sex, would it not?"

--Louis Midgley
_Ludd
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Re: The Top Ten Happenings in Mopologetics, 2014

Post by _Ludd »

Another great year-end list, Doctor. However, if you ask me, this blow up on Dan Peterson's blog over the Ben Park review of David Holland's book deserves at least an honorable mention (and a link).
_Markk
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Re: The Top Ten Happenings in Mopologetics, 2014

Post by _Markk »




Will we have to wait 2 more years for the "first ten years of mopology" reviewed? I hope not Scratch...it may not last two more years.

What is the #1 for the first 8 years?
Don't take life so seriously in that " sooner or later we are just old men in funny clothes" "Tom 'T-Bone' Wolk"
_Doctor Scratch
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Re: The Top Ten Happenings in Mopologetics, 2014

Post by _Doctor Scratch »

Ludd wrote:Another great year-end list, Doctor. However, if you ask me, this blow up on Dan Peterson's blog over the Ben Park review of David Holland's book deserves at least an honorable mention (and a link).


There is something of a tradition of this sort of thing happening, because for whatever reason, big Mopologetic events seem to have a habit of happening mid-December, after the list has been posted. For example, the 2012 "Top Ten" actually had to backtrack a bit into 2011 in order to cover the infamous TIME/Lightbox "Happy Vallen Photo Essay" incident.
"[I]f, while hoping that everybody else will be honest and so forth, I can personally prosper through unethical and immoral acts without being detected and without risk, why should I not?." --Daniel Peterson, 6/4/14
_Everybody Wang Chung
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Re: The Top Ten Happenings in Mopologetics, 2014

Post by _Everybody Wang Chung »



Thanks for providing the list, Shades. These lists are all truly golden and will forever stand as a monument for future generations to enjoy.

No doubt future generations will read these lists with equal parts amusement and confusion. They will wonder how the Church ever allowed these embarrassing Mopologists to exist.
"I'm on paid sabbatical from BYU in exchange for my promise to use this time to finish two books."

Daniel C. Peterson, 2014
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