You can enter the Kingdom of God right now.

[_spotlight]

When Einstein did his thought experiment he was dealing with the unseen. In a similar way thought experiments can be done about the presence of a greater reality. I am sorry you can't see the value of thoughts. I happen to value thoughts much higher than anything seen in this world. I guess we are just very different.

But his thought experiment related to the real world in a manner that it could be tested. It did not deal with something totally unobserved.

[_spotlight]

Jo,

There is no other theory of science as well established as the theory of evolution. It takes some time to cover all of the areas of evidence that support it which is why you seem to be able to just gloss over the facts - because you haven't spent the necessary time to become familiar with them. You simply imagine they don't exist.

The terminology "survival of the fittest" does not mean survival of the strongest. It is a waste of time discussing the topic with someone who doesn't bother to learn even the basics of the theory which is the minimum necessary in order to have an intelligible conversation. Animals that wander into caves lose their eyes over time. That is also evolution. It isn't always progress as naïvely defined. Every time a missing link is found the creationists declare two new missing links. They don't want to know the truth. They just continue to believe what they want to believe. I did not want to believe evolution was correct. But I was willing to admit that the evidence is irrefutable after taking the time to become familiar with it.

Symbiotic relationships are actually very strong evidence for evolution. In fact, most symbiotic relationships display high degrees of co-speciation, as would be expected from evolutionary theory's predictions (in other words, the two organisms did evolve together).

I see from your comments about differences in children that you missed the lesson on Mendel.

It might be easier to start with how we know the age of the various strata first. But you and Frank don't seem to want this answer that science has arrived at after decades of research.

[_SteelHead]

Arguing the merits of science with those whose understanding of what science is, and how it operates is demonstrably, fundamentally flawed, while employing a medium that depends entirely upon the advancements of science......

Priceless.


Fore everything else there is mastercard.

[_huckelberry]

Spotlingt, I was a bit distracted when I finished that post. Even so I had a suspicion that it might need clarification. I had no intention to distinguish the fate of believers from that of unbelievers> I was viewing both under r the same general arch of development. We all start to disintegrate over time untill we are all gone. If there is actually a God that God could be a renewal of our spirits. That would apply to believers and unbelievers. Or if there is no God the finality of our eventual dissolution also works the same for believers and unbelievers.

Actually in my belief system lower level estates can become so bored they shut themselves off. Then the higher estate just makes a new one with no memories. The highest estate lives through the experience of the lower estates. The highest estate creates an environment so boredom can not manifest and cause a desire to end itself.

Franktalk,

I do not think I have any clear pictures of what living eterally could mean. In fact I am quite capable of wondering if the idea is both absurd and impossible. But I am not convinced. There could be eternal life we understand only tiny amounts of

I can see a point to your comment. If we live just ourself , eternity would get terribly long. The only approach I can imagine to it is an enourmouly expanded living in connection with others. I say that realizing I am the sort of person who values alone time.

Well I enjoy enough alone activities to have learned well that they have limits .

[_Franktalk]

But his thought experiment related to the real world in a manner that it could be tested. It did not deal with something totally unobserved.

You are actually pretty blind. The human condition is all around us. We swim in a sea of beliefs in God and the supernatural. Yet you can't see the forest for the trees. You instead just think people are stupid. Just maybe you are blind to what they feel. There is something in each of us and if we allow it to be turned on then we experience some level of spirituality. To you it is not real because you can't attach a wire to it. But for billions of people it is real. They know there is something more than what we see. Of course they are confused because no one is showing them what true reality actually is. And if they were to be shown they would reject it anyway.

I think you would be hard pressed to design a place more dynamic and more prone for conflict than this place. Almost like someone got bored and designed a place to play in.

[_Franktalk]

Spotlight,

Just some information on thought experiments since it appears you are confused.

http://www.pitt.edu/~jdnorton/Goodies/C ... the_light/

[_spotlight]

Spotlight,

Just some information on thought experiments since it appears you are confused.

http://www.pitt.edu/~jdnorton/Goodies/C ... the_light/

Maybe you are misunderstanding me. Einstein's thoughts about EM radiation are thoughts about an observable phenomenon.

[_jo1952]

Jo, you need to do some reading about what evolutionary theory actually says. All you are showing is that you don't understand it at all.

I understand it. It has the same types of cognitive dissonance found inside of religion. Many of the theories of science suffer the same symptoms. Meanwhile, there are zero scholars on the earth, regardless of their field of study and belief, who have been able to prove anything about human reality (who we are, why we are here, what happens after death).

Followers of religion and science do so because it makes them happy; it makes them happy because they believe what is taught. Followers of both treat those who don't agree with them like crap. Maybe people don't want peace. Or maybe they don't recognize why there is no peace. We are suffering the consequences; and it is getting worse.

I believe that if we could start believing that WE are the "Father"...be able to believe our human reality (who we are, why we are here) is that we are advanced humans participating in a phase of an eternal round, we might have a chance to recover---instead of needing to wait for our "Christ"/Administrator to return and set up the government which will finally heal the world. This means that as things get progressively worse before He comes back, our children and their children are going to be born into worse and worse circumstances. Neither religion nor science have been able to provide us answers concerning human reality; science is looking for physical evidence, and religion is stuck on mystical answers. Neither allows for any other possibility. Thus, we perpetuate our problems without realizing that it is our belief systems which are preventing us from solving our problems. Science doesn't think it matters to know who we are. Science is content with the pursuit of physical evidence. If we believed we are the Father, our perspective would change how we see everything which would then allow us to start saving our world from the suffering our beliefs have perpetuated.

I now believe that it doesn't matter what we believe or what we do inside of mortality, because, in the end, we are still eternal...and that there is a purpose for participating inside of mortality which cannot change who we really are. Some may ask why I am bothering to post if it ultimately doesn't matter. I post because we could change the amount of suffering that takes place inside of mortality. The avatars who enter mortality before the government our Administrator will set-up endure much more suffering than those who enter afterward.

[_Franktalk]

Maybe you are misunderstanding me. Einstein's thoughts about EM radiation are thoughts about an observable phenomenon.

No misunderstanding at all. Thought experiments about a greater reality can be verified by dying. Whats the big deal? It is you who places limits on what is considered evidence. Somehow personal evidence has no weight for you. For me it is the only evidence that matters.

Once again you are showing any lack of depth in the human condition. You ignore life's finer aspects and instead limit yourself to book learning. You appear to be a two dimensional book easily replaced by another two dimensional book.

We all will experience death. So we all will have a personal experience that will verify the existence of a greater reality. I am happy with my views on the greater reality and I do not fear leaving this mortal existence. Typically someone with your views on reality scream out for God to save them or cry like babies when the moment arrives. And why is that? Because you have closed off your mind to thinking about anything but this world. People with your world view love this place. I don't love this place. I would love to see it transform into the Kingdom of Heaven. But religious people and science people stand in the way. They love the hell they have made of this place.

1Co_15:55 O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?

[_spotlight]

Frank,
I see your penchant for fantasy extends beyond the imagined realm of the afterlife to this life as well. "And why is that?" It is because you imagine it to be so. Hope that helps.