jo1952 wrote: Meanwhile, there are zero scholars on the earth, regardless of their field of study and belief, who have been able to prove anything about human reality (who we are, why we are here, what happens after death).
The same holds true for chimpanzees even though they are smarter than humans: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zsXP8qeFF6A And there is no evidence even after teaching them to sign that they waste time making up stuff about an afterlife! They beat human intelligence hands down.
Followers of ... science do so because it makes them happy;
This board never disappoints - least expensive entertainment to be found.
Kolob’s set time is “one thousand years according to the time appointed unto that whereon thou standest” (Abraham 3:4). I take this as a round number. - Gee
Res Ipsa wrote: Jo, you need to do some reading about what evolutionary theory actually says. All you are showing is that you don't understand it at all.
I understand it. It has the same types of cognitive dissonance found inside of religion. Many of the theories of science suffer the same symptoms. Meanwhile, there are zero scholars on the earth, regardless of their field of study and belief, who have been able to prove anything about human reality (who we are, why we are here, what happens after death).
Followers of religion and science do so because it makes them happy; it makes them happy because they believe what is taught. Followers of both treat those who don't agree with them like crap. Maybe people don't want peace. Or maybe they don't recognize why there is no peace. We are suffering the consequences; and it is getting worse.
I believe that if we could start believing that WE are the "Father"...be able to believe our human reality (who we are, why we are here) is that we are advanced humans participating in a phase of an eternal round, we might have a chance to recover---instead of needing to wait for our "Christ"/Administrator to return and set up the government which will finally heal the world. This means that as things get progressively worse before He comes back, our children and their children are going to be born into worse and worse circumstances. Neither religion nor science have been able to provide us answers concerning human reality; science is looking for physical evidence, and religion is stuck on mystical answers. Neither allows for any other possibility. Thus, we perpetuate our problems without realizing that it is our belief systems which are preventing us from solving our problems. Science doesn't think it matters to know who we are. Science is content with the pursuit of physical evidence. If we believed we are the Father, our perspective would change how we see everything which would then allow us to start saving our world from the suffering our beliefs have perpetuated.
I now believe that it doesn't matter what we believe or what we do inside of mortality, because, in the end, we are still eternal...and that there is a purpose for participating inside of mortality which cannot change who we really are. Some may ask why I am bothering to post if it ultimately doesn't matter. I post because we could change the amount of suffering that takes place inside of mortality. The avatars who enter mortality before the government our Administrator will set-up endure much more suffering than those who enter afterward.
If you understood evolutionary theory, you wouldn't post nonsense about it.
You also wouldn't criticize science for failing to "prove" things.
Science does provide some evidence regarding what you label "human reality."
Who are we? Intelligent relatives of apes. Nothing special.
Why we are here? Random mutation plus non-random natural selection.
What happens after death? We decompose.
It's weird to hear you criticize scientists for not "proving" stuff and then watch you pivot to a bunch of stuff you imagine in your head and try to pass off as "reality."
“The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists.”
― Hannah Arendt, The Origins of Totalitarianism, 1951
spotlight wrote:Frank, I see your penchant for fantasy extends beyond the imagined realm of the afterlife to this life as well. "And why is that?" It is because you imagine it to be so. Hope that helps.
Let us go on an adventure. Somehow happenstance has turned to you and you find yourself on deaths door. You start to ponder how you body will be eaten by worms and bugs. Slowly over time roots creep in to your now dead body and they shoot tubes into your rotten flesh so it can consume your nutrient rich rotten flesh. In time you become a tree since it is the thing which consumed your body. But you could care less because you have faded to black and have ceased to exist. Never to post snarky comments again for eternity. You had your chance and you made no major impact on anything or anyone. Your whole life was a waste of time. All you did until the day you died was repeat what others told you was true. But that charge your ego felt while it was alive has long since faded. You are nothing and will be nothing for eternity.
Res Ipsa wrote:Who are we? Intelligent relatives of apes. Nothing special.
So I can call you a monkeys uncle and you would be OK with that?
I don't care what you call me, Franktalk. It would, however, be inaccurate, as I have no nephews who are monkeys.
What I am is the descendant of a common ancestor of me and my ape cousins. I don't think we have a single word for that.
“The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists.”
― Hannah Arendt, The Origins of Totalitarianism, 1951
spotlight wrote:Frank, I see your penchant for fantasy extends beyond the imagined realm of the afterlife to this life as well. "And why is that?" It is because you imagine it to be so. Hope that helps.
Let us go on an adventure. Somehow happenstance has turned to you and you find yourself on deaths door. You start to ponder how you body will be eaten by worms and bugs. Slowly over time roots creep in to your now dead body and they shoot tubes into your rotten flesh so it can consume your nutrient rich rotten flesh. In time you become a tree since it is the thing which consumed your body. But you could care less because you have faded to black and have ceased to exist. Never to post snarky comments again for eternity. You had your chance and you made no major impact on anything or anyone. Your whole life was a waste of time. All you did until the day you died was repeat what others told you was true. But that charge your ego felt while it was alive has long since faded. You are nothing and will be nothing for eternity.
I however feel otherwise.
Here's an important place where I think you and I part company, Franktalk:
I don't believe that wanting my existence not to end at death is a good reason to believe there is life after death. I don't believe that wanting my life to have a greater purpose is a good reason to believe it has a greater purpose. I don't believe that being afraid of my existence ending is a good reason to believe it won't.
“The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists.”
― Hannah Arendt, The Origins of Totalitarianism, 1951
spotlight wrote:Frank, I see your penchant for fantasy extends beyond the imagined realm of the afterlife to this life as well. "And why is that?" It is because you imagine it to be so. Hope that helps.
Let us go on an adventure. Somehow happenstance has turned to you and you find yourself on deaths door. You start to ponder how you body will be eaten by worms and bugs. Slowly over time roots creep in to your now dead body and they shoot tubes into your rotten flesh so it can consume your nutrient rich rotten flesh. In time you become a tree since it is the thing which consumed your body. But you could care less because you have faded to black and have ceased to exist. Never to post snarky comments again for eternity. You had your chance and you made no major impact on anything or anyone. Your whole life was a waste of time. All you did until the day you died was repeat what others told you was true. But that charge your ego felt while it was alive has long since faded. You are nothing and will be nothing for eternity.
I however feel otherwise.
You presume too much. I actually spent my career in R&D and helped invent some new technologies. But in time everyone will fade into oblivion. I'm ok with that. Chimpanzees are good with it too as is the rest of the animal kingdom. We are not special. I wonder who in your mind makes what you term a major impact on others? Joseph Smith? His impact will be remembered for that of a con that damaged and wasted lives. The only thing I'd consider a major positive impact would be the technologies that increase our lifespan and the comforts of life. All the woo can be deposited in a dumpster.
Kolob’s set time is “one thousand years according to the time appointed unto that whereon thou standest” (Abraham 3:4). I take this as a round number. - Gee
spotlight wrote:You presume too much. I actually spent my career in R&D and helped invent some new technologies. But in time everyone will fade into oblivion. I'm ok with that. Chimpanzees are good with it too as is the rest of the animal kingdom. We are not special. I wonder who in your mind makes what you term a major impact on others? Joseph Smith? His impact will be remembered for that of a con that damaged and wasted lives. The only thing I'd consider a major positive impact would be the technologies that increase our lifespan and the comforts of life. All the woo can be deposited in a dumpster.
So your worth is measured in some R&D? In my world view there is nothing new under the sun. We come here for the experience. The morning sun warming my face. A walk in nature where I hear the sounds of the native animals. Making friends and having relationships. These are things which I value. I will hold onto these memories for eternity. I will live countless lives and help create countless worlds. In the greater realm I have billions of friends and I remember every moment of every mortal life I ever lived. Of the two of us only one of us has their act together. I am sure you feel that is you with your limited sense of worth and your fade to black attitude.
Can a thing which has no purpose give purpose to something else? If there is no purpose for man can man create purpose from nothing? How does your R&D efforts make a difference? If you have no purpose how did you give purpose to your work? Or is this all part of the magic of evolution? Spontaneous purpose from the dust of the earth. If everything returns to dust did purpose really exist?
Just wondering how your fade to black world works.
Franktalk wrote:So your worth is measured in some R&D? In my world view there is nothing new under the sun. We come here for the experience. The morning sun warming my face. A walk in nature where I hear the sounds of the native animals. Making friends and having relationships. These are things which I value.
How many false dichotomies can you create? Why is R&D in some sort of competition with other experiences of life? A walk in nature? I spent every free minute of my youth and young adult life backpacking in the Sierras. It was my favorite activity. I can cherish friendships as well as the next person. You don't have to abandon science and man's accomplishments and accumulation of knowledge to enjoy these other areas of life.
I will hold onto these memories for eternity. I will live countless lives and help create countless worlds. In the greater realm I have billions of friends and I remember every moment of every mortal life I ever lived. Of the two of us only one of us has their act together.
Not sure I can help you with the narcissistic fantasies. Yeah I guess it is possible that your unevidenced view of the eternities is spot on and your deep understanding of physics will be restored to you when you die and this proves you are right not to work to comprehend any of that here. Heck, why work at all. The worst that could result is you die as a result, at which time you are restored to your former grandiose glory and exalted status.
...your limited sense of worth
Wow, you're not full of yourself are you? But I'll accept that assessment from you if on a sliding scale it just happens to lie to the left of your unlimited sense of self importance.
Kolob’s set time is “one thousand years according to the time appointed unto that whereon thou standest” (Abraham 3:4). I take this as a round number. - Gee