Gunnar wrote:More nonsense! The undeniable fact that we can successfully and predictably design and build structures and machines that perform as predicted by our current theories and knowledge demonstrate beyond reasonable doubt that our current interpretation of the forces of nature are more than correct enough for our current needs and purposes.
I need a teleportation device and an interdimensional portal. Science has not satisfied my needs. I think you have set the bar way too low. There are others who have limited their technology as well.
The fact that we have no teleportation devices or interdimensional portals does not either weaken our argument or strengthen yours in the slightest. Your statement here is a complete non sequitur and only further underscores your own irrationality and lack of substance.
No precept or claim is more likely to be false than one that can only be supported by invoking the claim of Divine authority for it--no matter who or what claims such authority.
“If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; but if you really make them think, they'll hate you.”
― Harlan Ellison
SteelHead wrote:Religious science naysayers poo pooing science on a medium entirely derived by science.
The irony.
Isn't it amazing how they consistently fail to grasp that irony no matter how many times it is pointed out to them?
Last edited by Guest on Thu Mar 31, 2016 5:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
No precept or claim is more likely to be false than one that can only be supported by invoking the claim of Divine authority for it--no matter who or what claims such authority.
“If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; but if you really make them think, they'll hate you.”
― Harlan Ellison
Gunnar wrote:Nonsense! There is still agreement that the gravitational constant is close to 6.67 × 10−11 m3 kg−1 s−2.
Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. Love this comment.
Is that because you don't understand what the equation describes? Or the definition of a constant? Proportionality? The ongoing process of improved weights and measures accuracy? Do you disagree with the law of Universal Gravitation?
The equation is describing the direct proportionality of the force to the masses, and the inverse proportionality to squared distance. The G is simply a constant used to portray numerically the proportionalities. As G is more accurately measured, the proportionality is more accurately portrayed. In no way does the more accurate measurement of G deny the statement of the proportionality of the relationship.
It is ironic that you would post the links you did, because they clearly show a scientific process of increasingly precise measurement that allows G to be more accurately determined.
In other words, your links were in direct support of the scientific process being discussed here. Or as Gunnar put it so eloquently to Jo:
All you have really demonstrated in your last post is your abject ignorance and contempt for the scientific process and how it really works. It is not nearly as self-limiting as you suggest. Nor are scientists as stubbornly opposed to new ideas and insights and ideas that honestly challenge what we now know or think we know as you think they are.
Thank you Lemmie! You said it much better than I did!
No precept or claim is more likely to be false than one that can only be supported by invoking the claim of Divine authority for it--no matter who or what claims such authority.
“If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; but if you really make them think, they'll hate you.”
― Harlan Ellison
I would like to further add that the willingness and ability of science to repeatedly reexamine and reevaluate its current theories and paradigms as new, more complete and more precise evidence becomes available and then reconfirm, modify or reject said theories as warranted by that new evidence is its greatest virtue and strength. The unwillingness and often outright refusal of religion, especially organized religion to do likewise is its greatest weakness and flaw, and virtually guarantees the establishment and perpetuation of error.
No precept or claim is more likely to be false than one that can only be supported by invoking the claim of Divine authority for it--no matter who or what claims such authority.
“If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; but if you really make them think, they'll hate you.”
― Harlan Ellison
Gunnar wrote:I would like to further add that the willingness and ability of science to repeatedly reexamine and reevaluate its current theories and paradigms as new, more complete and more precise evidence becomes available and then reconfirm, modify or reject said theories as warranted by that new evidence is its greatest virtue and strength. The unwillingness and often outright refusal of religion, especially organized religion to do likewise is its greatest weakness and flaw, and virtually guarantees the establishment and perpetuation of error.
While admitting that the "truth" taught by science is always shifting, you also demonstrate how it is that you will only believe what your leaders tell you to believe; just like the religious.
Gunnar wrote:I would like to further add that the willingness and ability of science to repeatedly reexamine and reevaluate its current theories and paradigms as new, more complete and more precise evidence becomes available and then reconfirm, modify or reject said theories as warranted by that new evidence is its greatest virtue and strength. The unwillingness and often outright refusal of religion, especially organized religion to do likewise is its greatest weakness and flaw, and virtually guarantees the establishment and perpetuation of error.
While admitting that the "truth" taught by science is always shifting, you also demonstrate how it is that you will only believe what your leaders tell you to believe; just like the religious.
The telling difference is that science can reliably back up its claims with evidence. As long as they can do that (which they generally do very well), it would be foolish not to accept their findings. No one who has made any serious and honest attempt to study science and its history and the consequent technological progress and improvements resulting from it can honestly or reasonably deny the spectacular success of science in continually improving our understanding of how reality works over time. I see no comparable or analogous progress in real understanding of reality resulting from faith based religion and claimed divine revelation. When it comes to real understanding of reality and how the universe works, science is really the only game in town.
And none of this really conflicts with what Einstein had to say about appreciating the mystery and the spirit of discovery. My favorite quote from Einstein is "Reason without faith is lame, but faith without reason is blind." By faith, he did not mean faith in a divine, omnipotent being, but in our ability to discover, work out and appreciate the mysteries and wonders of the universe. But if I had to choose between those two extremes (reason without faith or faith without reason), I would rather be lame than blind.
Last edited by Guest on Thu Mar 31, 2016 7:34 pm, edited 4 times in total.
No precept or claim is more likely to be false than one that can only be supported by invoking the claim of Divine authority for it--no matter who or what claims such authority.
“If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; but if you really make them think, they'll hate you.”
― Harlan Ellison
Gunnar wrote:Thank you Lemmie! You said it much better than I did!
You're welcome, it was really more of a joint effort--hope you don't mind me addressing your Jo quote at the end to Franktalk.
Of course I don't mind! Don't be silly!
(Although I gather Franktalk and Jo usually come as a tag team, correct?!)
Apparently so.
No precept or claim is more likely to be false than one that can only be supported by invoking the claim of Divine authority for it--no matter who or what claims such authority.
“If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; but if you really make them think, they'll hate you.”
― Harlan Ellison
