Science is a tool that can be abused!

[_Franktalk]

Oh how nice. And why would this be the case? Really Frank, pull your head out...

This is why you would never receive any truth on an inward journey. You already have your mind made up. Those are called idols.

[_spotlight]

This is why you would never receive any truth on an inward journey. You already have your mind made up.

Au contraire, it is you that has his mind already made up. It had to be to take an inward journey that cannot be construed as a test else the inward journey will fail. That you fail to comprehend this says it all Frank. A donkey incapable of speech.

Those are called idols.

Then you are all idols, Frank.

[_Franktalk]

Au contraire, it is you that has his mind already made up. It had to be to take an inward journey that cannot be construed as a test else the inward journey will fail. That you fail to comprehend this says it all Frank. A donkey incapable of speech.

Those are called idols.

Then you are all idols, Frank.

I think this post will wrap things up.

[_Bret Ripley]

I think this post will wrap things up.

I think that post wrapped things up, but I won't know for sure until someone confirms it via Vision Quest.

[_Chap]

The way I see it if Joseph was sleeping with a bunch of women and the women really wanted to make it mean something then where are all of the offspring? I mean look at Brigham Young. You can trace back his kids. Where are Joseph's? Kind of seems phony to me. Like he married them but did not have intercourse. You seem to me to be a person who requires evidence. So show me the evidence.

Chap responds by citing (as one does ...) the usual multiple strands of evidence, ranging from the Temple Lot affidavits to the church's own essays, all pointing relentlessly in the direction that (surprise!) Joseph Smith had sex with a considerable number of women apart from Emma, his only legal wife. He then asks:

Did you not know about this?

And Franktalk (he of the inner journey, he who has cast aside the world, he to whom the creator of the universe has revealed The Truth) responds:

Sure, don't care.

Something a bit wrong there, don't you think?

[Guest]

I think this post will wrap things up.

I think that post wrapped things up, but I won't know for sure until someone confirms it via Vision Quest.

Vision Quest:

This transformational experience has sometimes been done with the use of hallucinogens such as peyote, mescaline, and the South American Iawaska plant during sacred initiation rites.

The benefits of a vision quest:
Move beyond outmoded paradigms

(OMG what a fantastic confirmation with what Franktalk said!!! There's proof for ya right there!)

God, grant me the serenity to accept
the things I cannot change,
the courage to change the things I can,
and the wisdom to know the difference.
http://www.crystalinks.com/visionquest.html

This last bit looks like the use of ethanol has sneaked into the category of substance abuse useful as aids in obtaining this transformational experience.

Let's listen in on Franktalk's prayer on the edge of the circle of stones with a cross inside:

Oh great Wankan Tanka I am not here to test the reality of the afterlife, I acknowledge that it exists beforehand without evidence. I now am prepared to cast aside science for this greater truth. All except the benefits that have accrued to mankind from the pursuit of science, those I will cling to in my hypocrisy. They did not really manifest from the theories of science anyhow but were lucky accidents and the moon walk was staged.

As I lose my mind temporarily, I am ready to testify that this experience proves the reality of that realm in which you reside. Are you bored Wankan Tanka? We will soon fix that by sending you back to this world where you can complete the cycle and experience repetitive newness. Thank you great wankan one for showing me the meaning of life the wankan way.

[Guest]

And Franktalk (he of the inner journey, he who has cast aside the world, he to whom the creator of the universe has revealed The Truth) responds:

Sure, don't care.

Something a bit wrong there, don't you think?

Answering facts that disprove his inner truth is not something Frank bothers with. It displays doubt, and acknowledges (if only a little) that his faith is based in something other than reality. Either that or by the time he posts a reply it is lost from his memory.

[_SteelHead]

To paraphrase Mr Utchdorf : Doubt your science before you doubt your conjecture.

[_Gunnar]

And FT will probably never be able to recognize or acknowledge even to himself how completely and thoroughly he has managed to destroy his own credibility and reveal his own arrogance, hypocrisy and solipsism. He has provided us with a lot of entertainment and unintented hilarity, however, and I, for one, have learned a lot from the responses of many of the contributors to this thread, and from my own efforts to research the issues he raised and expose their inherent flaws.

[_The CCC]

To paraphrase Mr Utchdorf : Doubt your science before you doubt your conjecture.

Like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lysenkoism