Nibley: Footnote faker or not?

[_Kevin Graham]

I don't have a problem calling him a scholar, but he was a very untrustworthy scholar.

[_Kishkumen]

Later I read Nibley's ludicrous defense of the Book of Abraham and saw that it involved misrepresenting the papyri in ways that could only be understood as intended deception. He flat out lied in a couple of instances. And that was it for me. I never had a problem calling him a dishonest person from that point on. I mean how can anyone make these kinds of "honest mistakes" by accident? Doesn't make sense to me. They were used because they furthered the thesis he was driving home and he just hoped no one would bother to look up his sources. Maybe that's why he had a tendency to bury his chapters in dozens of footnotes. To give the impression that he had actually read all this stuff for himself, and intimidate the rest of us into thinking we have no business questioning the integrity of such an intellectual God.

Maybe Gee took his cues from his mentor. I know you have done the legwork on Book of Abraham issues, so your word on this carries weight.

[_Markk]

And I thought a homer was a greek poet or a score in baseball.

I first encountered Nibley as an investigator, through his stuff on the Egyptian papyri in the New Era, If I recall correctly, and I was not impressed then. When I later encountered his attack on "Mrs. Brodie", helpfully attached by rubber band to NMKMH by the BYU book store employees, I was very disappointed. So I've never considered Nibley to be a great church scholar or any kind of scholar.

However, my opinion of him rose again when I encountered his heterodox opinions on politics and his skepticism of the touted "artifacts" that were being promoted by Jakeman and Christensen. Stela 5...that was truly embarrassing.

I think that "Sgt Nibley, PhD" is a pretty good description of him. He was a good soldier with more education than his fellows, and he put it in the service of his tribal nation. This may have involved some internal conflict for him, but he persisted and served to the end. So he was a loyal son of Zion, an apologist, when he *might* have been a scholar. We'll never really know.

Okay, I agree we can never know what could have been, which has been one of my points. The same with people like Lenny Bias, we cannot know what could have been. But with Nibley we do know a lot more...and like I wrote pages ago he had a very good run, and was very successful to his chosen audience.

Would Bias have been the next Jordan type of talent? I think so...but we will never know. The same with Nibley...although I have no idea what you guys expected of him, find Atlantis? I have no idea. Which is why I have asked for a benchmark for success.

A "score" in baseball? never mind...we are certainly from different sides of the tracks.

[_sock puppet]

I would refer to Nibley as a pontificator who tried his best, straining to extrapolate a legitimacy from antiquities for Mormon claims. He started out with an impossibly wide chasm, and came up short in trying to span it. But in the process, he impressed many young Mormons who were trying to figure out if they could make disoover such connections before ultimately realizing they were going to have to choose whether to live with the chasm in the background of their LDS lives or that there was no connection and move on.

[_kairos]

Going to the man or woman TBM in a typical ward and ask Who is Hugh Nibley? High probability the answer will include words like Mormon scholar, brilliant teacher, great Mormon apologist but way over my head in what he writes.
Let's go to Todd Compton " Nibley was complicated,sometimes brilliant but sometimes big picture contexts not understandable, serious questions about the legitimacy of his scholarship usually for pulling too much out of a source.

Markk- Nibley is a hack -hope I got that right.

Others here- faker of footnotes, pseudo scholar, untrustworthy scholar

Others- child abuser

What significant tags did I miss?

And what tag will Nibley be most remembered?

[_Kishkumen]

Let's go to Todd Compton " Nibley was complicated,sometimes brilliant but sometimes big picture contexts not understandable, serious questions about the legitimacy of his scholarship usually for pulling too much out of a source.

Todd Compton probably put it best and most accurately. I would rate his response above most others.

[_Markk]

Let's go to Todd Compton " Nibley was complicated,sometimes brilliant but sometimes big picture contexts not understandable, serious questions about the legitimacy of his scholarship usually for pulling too much out of a source.

Todd Compton probably put it best and most accurately. I would rate his response above most others.

Come on Kish, what does that mean?

It is just PC BS...I can read into Compton's response that HN was a hack.

Hitler was complicated and sometimes brilliant, many serial killers are complicated and sometimes brilliant. I am not in anyway, shape, or form, comparing HN to Hitler or serial killers, but come on...I think we can get a little "more real" and deeper in relating our impressions of the man, especially on a board that typically tears folks apart...e.g. DCP, Hamblin, Trump, Bush, Clinton...etc. Should KG just say "Trump is complicated and sometimes brilliant, who sometimes embellishes a context"...if he did the off topic board would be the " the off topic bored."

Saying it is complicated is a term folks use when they don't want to discuss a issue...when someone asks a person how their relationship might be, you hear..."it's complicated"...meaning its a mess and they don't want to tell you the in-depth facts.

Compton basically wrote he is a eccentric person that confuses facts and "makes crap up" (pulling too much out of a source)...which you said he did not do in one of the first posts you wrote, which I responded to.

HN teaching chapel Mormons that "Jesus secretly taught the 1st century apostles, GA, and 70s LDS temple ceremonies in the 1st century Jerusalem Temple" is "making crap up" Kish.

[_Maksutov]

Saying it is complicated is a term folks use when they don't want to discuss a issue...when someone asks a person how their relationship might be, you hear..."it's complicated"...meaning its a mess and they don't want to tell you the in-depth facts.

No, Mark, sometimes life and people are just complicated. If your personal feelings or your limited understanding keeps you from grasping that, it is not the fault of a board full of people who are trying to protect some deceased Mormon's reputation. Good grief. You think this board is a Hugh Nibley fan club? You're back to your distortions and exaggerations again.

[_Doctor Steuss]

I can't be the only one getting a bit of a chortle out of the fact that in a group of scholars, and a non-scholar, the only one jealous of Nibley’s career is the non-scholar.

[_Maksutov]

I can't be the only one getting a bit of a chortle out of the fact that in a group of scholars, and a non-scholar, the only one jealous of Nibley’s career is the non-scholar.

It is amusing. I think some jealousy of Kish and his standing on this board may also be operative here. Oh well.