MG & JLHPROF: From Whence Come Spiritual Experiences?

[Guest]

wubba lubba dubba!

[Guest]

[Guest]

I had the burning in the bosom confirming the Book of Mormon wasn’t true

Joseph Smith
"The Holy Ghost has no other effect than pure intelligence. It is more powerful in expanding the mind, enlightening the understanding, and storing the intellect with present knowledge, of a man who is of the literal seed of Abraham, than one that is a Gentile, though it may not have half as much visible effect upon the body; for as the Holy Ghost falls upon one of the literal seed of Abraham, it is calm and serene; and his whole soul and body are only exercised by the pure spirit of intelligence; while the effect of the Holy Ghost upon a Gentile, is to purge out the old blood, and make him actually of the seed of Abraham. That man that has none of the blood of Abraham (naturally) must have a new creation by the Holy Ghost. In such a case, there may be more of a powerful effect upon the body, and visible to the eye, than upon an Israelite, while the Israelite at first might be far before the Gentile in pure intelligence."

JLHPROF,

Is the above really the kind of gobledygook that you look to as a reflection of the divine and for guidance in your life?

What does this nonsense even mean? Can you explain how someone might put these imaginary observations to some practical use or advantage in their life?

Do you understand that, were the individual who wrote this alive today, chances are that he would, at some point in that life, be serving a long and well deserved sentence in prison?

Is this really the best Choice 1 response you can muster to posts from the likes of IHAQ, Doc Cam, Themis and Lemmie in the latter pages of this thread?

Just asking.

[_DoubtingThomas]

Where does this sense of right and wrong come from?

In the middle east some think suicide bombings are a good act for God. In the US many see sex outside marriage as an abomination. Others see abortion as murder. In early Utah it was acceptable to have slaves. Where is the universal sense of right and wrong?

Now, it is true we humans do share some morals, but the morals we all share are explained by evolution and natural selection. For example we evolved to have families, work together to hunt for food, and take care of one another for our survival. We humans survived because we had certain mortals, but it is simply natural selection.

As Dawkins said, " The universe that we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but pitiless indifference.”"

[_Themis]

But it is faith that moves one forward from that point into active belief/hope. Yes, we are all still stepping into the unknown after having experience what we consider...or hope...to be spiritual experiences. We each have to decide what we're going to do with these 'peak experiences' and how they will fit into our overall schema of things, including faith.

Regards,
MG

So MG how about giving us an answer on how this faith is a positive trait? We know many will move forward with faith even without spiritual experiences to believe things that are not true. This is the main tool of the fraud, and religion is filled with frauds. So is this faith a positive trait for someone who has this faith in Scientology?

[_DrW]

Where does this sense of right and wrong come from?

In the middle east some think suicide bombings are a good act for God. In the US many see sex outside marriage as an abomination. Others see abortion as murder. In early Utah it was acceptable to have slaves. Where is the universal sense of right and wrong?

Now, it is true we humans do share some morals, but the morals we all share are explained by evolution and natural selection. For example we evolved to have families, work together to hunt for food, and take care of one another for our survival. We humans survived because we had certain mortals, but it is simply natural selection.

Exactly right. Certain of the beneficial social behaviors we normally think of as uniquely human, such as recognition of the fact that a unfamiliar member of a group is in danger, and the empathy required to spend time and energy to help the endangered individual, are already present in lab rats.

By the time one gets to primates, highly complex social orders, with behaviors such as shared care of the young and deception for personal advantage (especially when it comes to food and sex) have evolved.

Relatively recent recognition of substantial differences in brain morphology and fine structure have taken us beyond the time when it could credibly be said that humans are the "naked apes". Nonetheless, the many features that millions of years of evolution have left us share with other primates should be recognized and appreciated.

[Guest]

[_grindael]

Mental on another thread,

I can not explain my spiritual evidence with/to you and you cannot explain yours to me. It's like trying to explain the taste of salt.

Then, Mental says,

The closest I can come to describing some of the experiences I'm referring to is a 'burning in the bosom'. Other times have been thoughts streaming...complete sentences and coherent thought... without preexisting encouragement or causal factors. And they've been directly applicable to a situation in which I later could see I was in need of that inspiration.

You indeed did explain/describe them in the second quote. So who is lying? YOU ARE. It is not mocking someone's spiritual experiences/evidences to point out when someone is lying about them. But leave it to you to start up another pity party.

Poor widdle ol Mental the liar.

[_grindael]

If one is to believe in Joseph's First Vision, it becomes apparent that hindsight brought him greater clarity.

It is apparent that hindsight brought him a greater need to invent more and more of the story.

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

That must be nice. Instead of hard work, arduous study, research, diligence, and a commitment to an academic discipline you can just get that sweet, sweet Pure Intelligence TM.

And who's coattails are you riding again?

You inadvertently prove my point. It's precisely because we can stand on the shoulders of others, have the cumulative knowledge of science and various forms of studies, that we begin to untangle the mysteries of life, the universe, the human condition.

"Pure Intelligence" is just another way of staying stupid while thinking yourself privileged with some sort of insider knowledge that is esoteric in nature.

- Doc