The US system hates the criminal, but loves more crime

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_DoubtingThomas
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The US system hates the criminal, but loves more crime

Post by _DoubtingThomas »

Nathan H Lents writing for December 2017 edition of Skeptic Magazine argues

In light of the remarkably low crimes rates and more important, low re-offending rates among the formerly incarcerated in Scandinavian countries, how can we label their approach as being "soft on crime?" In sharp contrast, the America system's "tough on crime" approach is met with notably higher rates of repeat offending. The American example is tough on criminals, but no on crime. In fact, there is ample evidence to demonstrate that our punitive practices do more to promote crime than to prevent it...Thought it may appear inconsistent with common sense to react to crime by affirming the dignity and value of individuals who have offended, and assuring their successful reintegration back into the community, there is abundant evidence to suggest this is precisely what promotes the abandonment of criminal activity. Humans are social mammals with a strong desire to belong to a community. When a humans being perceives himself as a valued member of a community, he will invest in the health ans safety of that community, rather than perceive his own needs as being separate from those of the larger community...For individuals to behave as valuable and respectful members of society, they must be treated as such


Andres Behring Breivik, the man responsible for the mass killings of 77 people in 2011, was only sentenced to 21 years in prison because this is the maximum sentence in Norway


"39% of Prisoners Should Not Be in Prison"
http://time.com/4596081/incarceration-report/
_subgenius
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Re: The US system hates the criminal, but loves more crime

Post by _subgenius »

DoubtingThomas wrote:
Andres Behring Breivik, the man responsible for the mass killings of 77 people in 2011, was only sentenced to 21 years in prison because this is the maximum sentence in Norway


The population of all of the Nordic countries (a.k.a. Scandinavian Countries) combined-Denmark (5,569,077), Finland (5,268,799), Iceland (317,351), Norway (5,147,792), and Sweden (9,723,809)-is roughly equal to the population of Texas.

Sweden gun owner percentage rate of about 32 whereas Texas comes in at 36.
Netherlands gun owner percentage rate of about 39 whereas Texas comes in at 36.
Denmark gun owner percentage rate of about 12 whereas Texas comes in at 36.
Finland gun owner percentage rate of about 32 whereas Texas comes in at 36.
Iceland gun owner percentage rate of about 30 whereas Texas comes in at 36.
Norway gun owner percentage rate of about 31 whereas Texas comes in at 36.


fun fact, this post and the OP both share the quality of the ever persistent apples to oranges fallacy.
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_DoubtingThomas
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Re: The US system hates the criminal, but loves more crime

Post by _DoubtingThomas »

subgenius wrote:fun fact, this post and the OP both share the quality of the ever persistent apples to oranges fallacy.


apples and oranges my @$$. If you compare the entire European continent to the US you would realize that the US is still high on crime.
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Re: The US system hates the criminal, but loves more crime

Post by _subgenius »

DoubtingThomas wrote:
subgenius wrote:fun fact, this post and the OP both share the quality of the ever persistent apples to oranges fallacy.


apples and oranges my @$$. If you compare the entire European continent to the US you would realize that the US is still high on crime.

it is absurd to even make that comparison. you too easily dismiss the relevant differences between "this" and "that" - and not just the fundamental differences in culture or attitude. But also the very real differences in crime reporting systems, how crimes are even measured, and so on. It is as if you are comparing currencies without adjusting for value or spending power....or better yet, its like you are one of those guys who says "a gallon of gas was only 18 cents in 1950 and compared to 2018 gas is 250 cents....2018 is high on gas prices."
Seek freedom and become captive of your desires...seek discipline and find your liberty
I can tell if a person is judgmental just by looking at them
what is chaos to the fly is normal to the spider - morticia addams
If you're not upsetting idiots, you might be an idiot. - Ted Nugent
_EAllusion
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Re: The US system hates the criminal, but loves more crime

Post by _EAllusion »

Are you arguing that the significantly lower incidence of violent crime in Scandinavian countries is the result of less reporting of crime subgenius?
_DoubtingThomas
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Re: The US system hates the criminal, but loves more crime

Post by _DoubtingThomas »

subgenius wrote:It is as if you are comparing currencies without adjusting for value or spending power"


Okay let's adjust because you think black and Latinos are to blame for all crime.
If you compare nordic countries to white (homogeneous) US states like West Virginia for example, you will learn nordic countries still have a much lower homicide rate.


Sources
""In all, 10 states are more than 90 percent white, including the three northern New England states, West Virginia, Iowa, Wyoming, Idaho, Montana, Kentucky and North Dakota.""
http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=93608&page=1

Homicide rates:
Norway 0.56 median age 39.2 years
Germany 0.85
Netherlands 0.61 median age 42.1 years
Denmark 0.99 median age 42 years
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U ... icide_rate

West Virginia 4.4 median age 41.3 years
Montana 3.5 median age 39.9
Kentucky 5.9 median age 38.3
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_c ... icide_rate

What is your explanation now??
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Re: The US system hates the criminal, but loves more crime

Post by _subgenius »

DoubtingThomas wrote:What is your explanation now??

Explanation for what? Your poor reasoning?

Consider first that I was born from a Latino mother and White father. The murder rate in my home is 0.0 and the median age is 30.5.
Seek freedom and become captive of your desires...seek discipline and find your liberty
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Re: The US system hates the criminal, but loves more crime

Post by _DoubtingThomas »

subgenius wrote: Explanation for what? Your poor reasoning?


Explain why the murder rate in Netherlands (0.61) is almost twelve times lower than in the state of Kentucky (5.9)?
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Re: The US system hates the criminal, but loves more crime

Post by _DoubtingThomas »

subgenius, why can't you just admit conservatives are full of crap? Do you always stop replying every time someone debunks what you say?
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Re: The US system hates the criminal, but loves more crime

Post by _subgenius »

DoubtingThomas wrote:
subgenius wrote: Explanation for what? Your poor reasoning?


Explain why the murder rate in Netherlands (0.61) is almost twelve times lower than in the state of Kentucky (5.9)?

That is easy, more people in Kentucky are being reported as "murdered"....but it might be because KY is not Caracas.
Seek freedom and become captive of your desires...seek discipline and find your liberty
I can tell if a person is judgmental just by looking at them
what is chaos to the fly is normal to the spider - morticia addams
If you're not upsetting idiots, you might be an idiot. - Ted Nugent
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