I can't hear you.

[_EAllusion]

You disgust me with that.

The draft is outside of political relevance for most people since it has been dead for two generations and there is no political will or push to revive it.

DocCam's point was that feminists are disingenuous or hypocrtical about seeking equality because they aren't pushing for equal treatment in being hypothetically available to be forced into military service.

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

Some 16 year old redditor is going to explain The Vagina Monologues to DocCam one day and he's going to flip.

I don't know why you think that's clever. I've seen it in person twice. Cool. Some day your non-binary partner is going to remind you xhe has xour balls in xer tote bag still and no, you can't have them back.

- Doc

[_Res Ipsa]

That you reduce selective service registration to sending in a gov't post card (with the excuse that we haven't had a draft in 40 years) is completely pathetic.

You disgust me with that.

Why is that worthy of your disgust? I've had three sons now register for SS. All they did was fill out this form. https://www.sss.gov/Portals/0/PDFs/regform_copyINT.pdf That's the only impact it's had on their lives. Any woman who wasn't to serve her country in the military can do so. Nothing about selective service changes that.

So why disgust?

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

hypothetically available to be forced into military service.

Hypothetically.

The level of dissonance is deafening.

- Doc

[_Res Ipsa]

And I don't think either of us has sufficient information on which to make those kinds of judgments. Arguably, one effect of last years marches was to lead more women to run for political office. http://time.com/5107499/record-number-o ... or-office/ That could be a sign that women are becoming more actively engaged in politics. I think its a good thing for people to be actively engaged in politics, so that looks like a good thing to me. And, circling back to where we started, since men control all three branches of government, it's men who are keeping the current inequality in selective service registration in place.

My point is also that, for every woman who took some kind of action to change women's circumstances, there was a long and loud line of men telling her she was mentally ill, narcissistic, divisive, promoting victimhood, or advocating feminist supremacy. Had women actually taken what those men said seriously, they'd still be treated like property and would not have the right to vote. If women want to have a march, I say all power to them. That's what we value in freedom of speech and assembly. When my wife told me she wanted to march, I didn't call her mentally ill or a narcissist. Knowing she hates to drive in downtown traffic, I offered to be shuttle service for her and anyone else that needed a ride. I do know that, since she marched last year, she's been more engaged in and energized about politics. I think the knee-jerk reaction to disparage and ridicule anything that smacks of feminism is silly and is not based on evidence or reason.

Did you or your wife hold up a giant sign of her pussy? And then stick her face through the middle of it? And then march around with a dumb grin on her face?

If not. Congrats. She's probably not mentally ill.

I think you're deliberately skewing the political point I'm making because you're so in the bag with this weird ass nonsense protesting pink pussy cap bull ____ you can't bring yourself to admit you've been supporting insanity that subordinates you at the expense of your manhood.

But, hey. You do you. Get to lickin' those latex boots at the crack of their whip.

- Doc

Frankly, Doc, you're the last person I'd trust for a diagnosis of mental illness. I don't think I've skewed any point you've made. If you think I have, show me and I'll be happy to unskew.

If the game you want to play is psychologically analyze strangers over the internet, I think you've got a bizarre misogynistic asshole streak that emerges when you are triggered by anything that resembles feminism. It's like some MRA version of Pavlov's dogs. That aside, you seem to be a reasonable fellow with some interesting ideas. So, now can we dispense with the insult-o-rama and discuss ideas?

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

Here are some more oppressed women, subjugated and subordinated by the Patriarchy to their very core:



SO TRIGGERED.

- Doc

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

RI,

If you don't want me to ramp up the asshole bit then it might behoove you to look at your posts in this thread and think about how you approached me in conversation.

And, you're right. I'm up front about my feeling with regard to 3rd Wave Feminism. I think it's vanity.

- Doc

[_Res Ipsa]

You're dodging reality that women as a whole, don't really want to be treated as equals to men.

Women as a whole? I'd love for you to introduce me to this "women as a whole" so I could interview her and learn once and for all what women think.

I didn't understand Doc to be making a point about what women as a whole want. I understood him to be ridiculing women who marched but did not carry the sign he thought they should carry. I responded by arguing why it was perfectly reasonable to pick a sign other than one promoting equality in Selective Service. Therefore, I would argue that I didn't dodge his point at all. I might not have addressed the point that you just expressed, but then you didn't express it until now.

I'm not sure why your point has any relevance to the march. I freely admit to not knowing what women as a whole want. The women I have know in my life have had all sorts of opinions on all kinds of things. That, in my opinion, doesn't disqualify any of them from carrying sign saying that women should get paid the same as a man for doing the same job. Or that they shouldn't be sexually harassed in the workplace. Most of the women I've discussed this particular subject with agree that it's unfair to subject only men to a military draft. Some favor requiring women to register. Some favor eliminating SS altogether. But, as this particular issue doesn't directly impact their lives in any meaningful way, it doesn't make their top 10 list of things to be concerned about. And, frankly, until there are any indications that a military draft will be reinstated, it doesn't make my top 10 either.

[_Jersey Girl]

Whew. I'm going to trust that these represent your honest and true thoughts because they must've flown out of your head and through your keyboard to my screen with no time for you to plan in advance what you were going to write.

That some women don't have one foot in the real world?

Or am I missing the meaning of the photo?

In context of the thread, and the discussion, the point I'm making is those women at that march or protest or circle jerk (whatever one wants to call it) don't give a flying [deleted] about equality, are privileged to the point of absurdly complaining about their lot in life, and are so blithely oblivious to the state of mankind they view virtually half the population as tyrants in the making.

I had to bold that one bit. That's what I meant when I said that some women don't have one foot in the real world. There's a kind of blindfolded egocentric naïvété represented in so much of what I see in those protests that it's difficult for me to attach to. I don't know how to better express it than that.

You know. It's so sad that so many men haven't had an encouraging word thrown their way for virtually their entire lives. They're opting out of higher education at crazy rates, they comprise over 84% of the homeless population, they make up something like 90% of workplace fatalities, their suicide rates are off the charts, and we keep getting fed that they're the problem, that feminism is equality, and that if you don't buy what those pussy-sign toting nutjobs are selling you're the enemy.

I wish I could give myself more time to respond to the above. I think that the feminist movement went off the rails a long time ago. There's a bunch of stuff I want to say here, but I'm not gonna lie, I find it really difficult at times and struggle with feeling compelled to weigh my words.

Give me a [deleted] break.

I hear you. There was a time in my life that I subscribed to an us vs. them mentality. I was more egocentric than I care to admit. I didn't give two craps about the lives or experience of men, didn't take time to notice or appreciate the work of men, the conditions of their lives, what they were subject to, what men need and require, what makes them thrive, and then...bit by bit, I did a complete about face. I have a couple of young dads, an early childhood education guru, and hundreds of little boys to thank for opening my eyes.

Again, I vote Democrat for a variety of reasons. However, I can plainly see by telling men, especially young men, that they're patriarchal oppressors, denizens of rape culture, and that these feminists can't distinguish between a man's competence and his tyranny. It's just all so odd and bizarre when I see other adults, especially men, buy into this Salvador Dali painting of ideology.

The bolded is an extreme statement and yet, I don't think you're far off the mark. It actually made me tear up.

I mean. I can see it plain as day. Click on this easy Google search of 'womens march 2018 signs' and tell me you see sober thinking, pragmatism, logic, a clear and coherent message (I'll call you a liar if you do):

https://www.google.com/search?q=womens+ ... 00&bih=769

I said before that I feel embarrassed by it. That hasn't changed.

What in the [deleted] is going on with people? I don't expect to change anyone's mind with my little rants on this obscure message, but[deleted], I'm certainly not going to watch lunatics here shoot off their mouths without letting them know they've gone off the reservation if they support this kind of thing. It's utterly depraved and bizarre.

- Doc

Again I find myself weighing my words in advance because I'm writing publicly and it's really hard for me to function that way. I think you're seeing a whole lot of social conditioning going on and until the pendulum finds it's center, you're not going to see anything much different from this.

Have you ever been on The Straight Dope Message Board? Here's a copy of the header:

It's taking longer than we thought! When are we going to pull our collective heads out of our own egocentricity and figure out that everyone's needs need to be met?

[_Res Ipsa]

RI,

If you don't want me to ramp up the asshole bit then it might behoove you to look at your posts in this thread and think about how you approached me in conversation.

And, you're right. I'm up front about my feeling with regard to 3rd Wave Feminism. I think it's vanity.

- Doc

Why should I care whether you act like an asshole? That's not a reflection on me -- that's a reflection on you.

OK, i'll bite. This is how I approached you in conversation:

Given the fact that we haven’t had a draft for about 40 years, it doesn’t surprise me that their weren’t signs demanding the right to send a postcard to the government. Feminists have worked to open up the opportunities for women who want to serve in the armed services.

So, is polite disagreement with you grounds for the Doc asshole special?