Hawkeye wrote:Damn, you have to be the dumbest idiot on the web.
unfortunately that crown rests securely on your head. You parade religion around with convenience as if you have any sort of insight or authority on the matter. And then worse, you prop up children to support your ignorance on political policy... where was yourhair-fire in2014 when the same was happening under your beloved bull of a president ya cuckold excuse of an adult.
In the face of madness, rationality has no power - Xiao Wang, US historiographer, 2287 AD.
Every record...falsified, every book rewritten...every statue...has been renamed or torn down, every date...altered...the process is continuing...minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except an endless present in which the Ideology is always right.
Hawkeye wrote:Damn, you have to be the dumbest idiot on the web.
unfortunately that crown rests securely on your head. You parade religion around with convenience as if you have any sort of insight or authority on the matter. And then worse, you prop up children to support your ignorance on political policy... where was yourhair-fire in2014 when the same was happening under your beloved bull of a president ya cuckold excuse of an adult.
This is some of the kind of stuff I was talking about when I said half assed reporting. And recall that I mentioned a Facebook conversation/debate on a friends Facebook the other week? My Facebook had the pics with the foil blankets (they're in the article) on their Facebook.
Makes me so darn mad!
How is anyone supposed to sort this stuff out when we're being fed c.r.a.p. stories like this?
Last edited by Google Feedfetcher on Mon Jun 18, 2018 6:03 am, edited 1 time in total.
Failure is not falling down but refusing to get up.
Chinese Proverb
If anyone knows the answer to these questions, please supply them.
1. Why are immigrant refugees (without documentation) coming through in between ports of entry instead of through ports of entry?
2. When immigrant refugees (without documentation) come through points of entry are their children being separated from them?
3. If the second group ^^^^isn't having their children taken away from them, then how come they can't arrange transportation for the first group to a port of entry? What is so blinking hard about that?
No, I've never seen the southern border.
Failure is not falling down but refusing to get up.
Chinese Proverb
Jersey Girl wrote:How in the world are we supposed to discern truth?
Weird. Back on page 3 I had already hit on every one of these things. But how does one go about engaging in critical thinking? It's a mystery.
honorentheos wrote:You seem lost in the weeds here. Historically the majority of unaccompanied minors who arrived at the US border were older adolescents as made the news back in 2014. You'll probably recall the hoopla around the Obama administration struggling to figure out what to do with them and similar complaints about where they were being kept while this was being worked out were all over the news.
That part of it isn't new and it is only partisan in that it's easy for the party not in power to criticize the one that is while the system remains overwhelmed.
What IS new is two fold: First, there is a rise in family units making the attempt to come to the US from Central America which means more younger kids and infants. And second, the Trump administration has taken a zero tolerance stance regarding immigrants who show up at the border which means they are prioritizing jailing the adults to await their hearings. It isn't clear how many are attempting to enter through ports of entry and declare themselves asylum seekers and how many are taking the chance of attempting to cross illegally but it seems in both cases there are reported "arrest first, assess later" actions being taken by border patrol. (my add to this new post: The ACLU cases involve women who were separated from their children upon entering the country seeking asylum. The entire crux of the ACLU's attempt to see this overturned is built around people who followed the rules for seeking asylum but were forcibly separated. The Vox article I quoted in my very first post on this subject touched on the fact there was inconsistency but clear cases where it was occurring at ports of entry...but yeah.)
What's old but now has a new twist is that there are laws that limit how long the US government can detain a minor. There are also laws that dictate how the US government must deal with families that are detained and believed to have entered the US illegally. The current administration's response to this is to forcibly separate the minors from the adults, charge the adults and jail them to await trial, then classify the kids as unaccompanied and send them off to be processed and set up with a sponsor to await their hearing. Hearings can take a year or more to occur.
Both sides are playing games with this, though. When it's reported that HSS has lost over a thousand kids who were sent to be with their sponsors, it implies an overly simplistic and sinister trafficking backdoor moving kids into the hands of pedophiles, pimps, and slave masters and the Trump admin is guilty of either letting this happen or even not caring if it happens. The reality is that most of those kids just disappeared with their sponsors who are mostly family members or otherwise connected with them through the process that led to them being assigned to the sponsor in the first place. There are highly publicized accounts of 8 kids who ended up working in a poultry plant but it's wrong to look at the issue as either purely innocuous or purely sinister. It's messy.
But this idea that because the government has been figuring out how to deal with the exponential increase in adolescent unaccompanied Central American immigrants for four or five years, so they have gotten better at providing legally compliant shelters as they seek and assign sponsors is glossing over what's changed during the Trump administration. Sure, the nursing baby torn from it's mother's breast makes good copy but doesn't represent even a small percentage of what is really happening. But neither is this boogey man idea that people faking being a family so they can be...processed together?...justifies forced separation of families to circumvent the laws around what the government is supposed to do with families and minors.
It's clear the Trump administration has shifted the priorities towards a harsher response towards those arriving here from Central America without visas. This has led to a lower priority being given to basic human rights and includes a clear and obvious move to circumvent international and US law. That's a BFD. The issue around whether or not a particular facility is a dog kennel or a place you would be willing to send your own kid for summer camp is a distraction.
The world is always full of the sound of waves..but who knows the heart of the sea, a hundred feet down? Who knows it's depth? ~ Eiji Yoshikawa
I don't recall if this has been brought up yet, but it's worth adding to the discussion just so we're clear that the Trump administration is leaning hard into prioritizing zero tolerance for people arriving here seeking amnesty -
Sessions Says Domestic and Gang Violence Are Not Grounds for Asylum
Attorney General Jeff Sessions on Monday made it all but impossible for asylum seekers to gain entry into the United States by citing fears of domestic abuse or gang violence, in a ruling that could have a broad effect on the flow of migrants from Central America.
Mr. Sessions’s decision in a closely watched domestic violence case is the latest turn in a long-running debate over what constitutes a need for asylum. He reversed an immigration appeals court ruling that granted it to a Salvadoran woman who said she had been sexually, emotionally and physically abused by her husband.
Relatively few asylum seekers are granted permanent entry into the United States. In 2016, for every applicant who succeeded, more than 10 others also sought asylum, according to data from the Department of Homeland Security. But the process can take months or years, and tens of thousands of people live freely in the United States while their cases wend through the courts.
Mr. Sessions’s decision overturns a precedent set during the Obama administration that allowed more women to claim credible fears of domestic abuse and will make it harder for such arguments to prevail in immigration courts. He said the Obama administration created “powerful incentives” for people to “come here illegally and claim a fear of return.”
If you're ajax, you probably celebrated. If you're a human with any kind of moral compass, hopefully this gives you pause.
The world is always full of the sound of waves..but who knows the heart of the sea, a hundred feet down? Who knows it's depth? ~ Eiji Yoshikawa
honorentheos wrote:I don't recall if this has been brought up yet, but it's worth adding to the discussion just so we're clear that the Trump administration is leaning hard into prioritizing zero tolerance for people arriving here seeking amnesty -
Sessions Says Domestic and Gang Violence Are Not Grounds for Asylum
Attorney General Jeff Sessions on Monday made it all but impossible for asylum seekers to gain entry into the United States by citing fears of domestic abuse or gang violence, in a ruling that could have a broad effect on the flow of migrants from Central America.
Mr. Sessions’s decision in a closely watched domestic violence case is the latest turn in a long-running debate over what constitutes a need for asylum. He reversed an immigration appeals court ruling that granted it to a Salvadoran woman who said she had been sexually, emotionally and physically abused by her husband.
Relatively few asylum seekers are granted permanent entry into the United States. In 2016, for every applicant who succeeded, more than 10 others also sought asylum, according to data from the Department of Homeland Security. But the process can take months or years, and tens of thousands of people live freely in the United States while their cases wend through the courts.
Mr. Sessions’s decision overturns a precedent set during the Obama administration that allowed more women to claim credible fears of domestic abuse and will make it harder for such arguments to prevail in immigration courts. He said the Obama administration created “powerful incentives” for people to “come here illegally and claim a fear of return.”
If you're ajax, you probably celebrated. If you're a human with any kind of moral compass, hopefully this gives you pause.
God.
Failure is not falling down but refusing to get up.
Chinese Proverb
Jersey Girl wrote: How in the holy living hell is anyone supposed to sort this stuff out when we're being fed c.r.a.p. stories like this?
well, the links in the cited article speaks to a Senate report that is public record, etc. Basically, it seems that a good practice is to seek a better understanding when a particular news story grabs you emotionally....emotionally. Always trust, but verify. My rule of thumb, which usually holds true, is to understand that Hawkeye seeks to inflame and not understand...facts are not always necessary to his agenda and therefore a deeper questioning is necessary....likewise, sources like Twitter or Facebook require a bit of skepticism since they are in the business of chatter.....they are not in the business of news or of facts.
Seek freedom and become captive of your desires...seek discipline and find your liberty I can tell if a person is judgmental just by looking at them what is chaos to the fly is normal to the spider - morticia addams If you're not upsetting idiots, you might be an idiot. - Ted Nugent