This is Disrespecting the Flag

[_Kevin Graham]

I've been seeing these weird versions of the American flag. Some that are all black and white with a blue line, some with a red line, some with a yellow line, some with a green line. How in the friggin hell is THIS not "disrespecting the American flag"??? The thin blue line is supposed to be a 'Blue Lives Matter" thing, the Red line is supposed to be a Fireman thing, the Green line is supposed to be a military thing, and I have no idea what the orange and yellow lines mean. But could you imagine if Black Lives Matter started with this gimmick co opting the US Flag for their political statements and put a single black line in the middle of the American flag? These same people waving these perverted forms of the US flag would be losing their crap about "disrespecting" the troops.

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

Are you talking about flag desecration or sales? I'm not sure that I'm following your line of reasoning here.



- Doc

[_Jersey Girl]

Doesn't Black Lives Matter use a black and white version of the US flag?

What difference does it really make? What consequence would you like to see these groups have?

[_Kevin Graham]

I'm surprised Doc, this is usually something right up your ally. You bend over backwards to point out hypocrisy, well this should be an easy one even for you.

All we hear nowadays from the Right is how the flag is being disrespected when a black guy kneels before it. These same people have no problem taking that flag and morphing it into something else entirely to satisfy their own political statements. I was thinking of this yesterday when I watched a local news station talk about how the local Firefighters climbed Stone Mountain "to honor 9-11 victims." They climbed it wearing their FF gear as well as toting a black American Flag with a red stripe. The local police did the same thing with a blue striped flag that looked all tattered and beaten like the one below. My first reaction was, WTF? How does this honor dead citizens by hoisting flags that were created more than a decade later in response to a social movement like Black Lives Matter?

Doc, what you're showing above is just some random person desecrating the flag. Yeah, no crap. That happens. But that is not the flag for "Black Lives Matter." Their flag looks like this. What we're seeing with these other perversions of the flag is becoming adopted by large nationwide organizations and becoming commercialized primarily by the same people who preach that everyone should stand at attention during the anthem. This is hypocrisy. And what is going on with this Punisher skull flag? Apparently it refers to Police Swat.

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

Well, I agree with you so you're not really going to get a contrarian opinion out of me this time. I think the hypocrisy of the Right when it comes to the flag is always on display. But I'm also not a big fan of mythologizing the flag to the point that it's this untouchable icon that people ought to worship.

Don't get me wrong. I love the flag. I do. I think it's has exceptional design and aesthetic features and is probably among the top ten flag designs in the world.

When I went through the SERE course and we were rounded up after a tough couple of days being abused, to turn around around as the sun was rising and hear our national anthem being played and our flag flapping lazily in the early morning light was very emotional. I clearly hold the values I think our flag represents dear.

I also understand why others would see the flag in a different light. It bothers me that there are huge swaths of the population that see the flag as a symbol of hate and oppression, but that's their opinion. I also don't like that there are huge swaths of the population that don't really have a connection to the positive symbolism of the flag in any meaningful way outside of a whatever they buy off Amazon.

- Doc

[_SteelHead]

The flag is a symbol of liberty and freedoms, without the ability to protest the symbols, they become hollow and meaningless.

[_EAllusion]

I'm not a fan of the flag in terms of aesthetics. I wish we would've kept the original circular design on the stars and just made the stars smaller as new states were added. That would be a bitchin' flag.

I'm not at all into mindless nationalistic pomp. I refused to stand for the pledge of allegiance in high school for that reason. I stand for the national anthem at events sheerly out of a different sort peer pressure and wouldn't do it at all if it wasn't a cultural tinderbox. This is not because I dislike America or am protesting American atrocities. Quite the contrary. I love my country and view its symbols as representative of its better moments and higher ideals. While the Statue of Liberty evokes more pride in me than the flag, I have no issue with the flag as a symbol. I just don't like worshipful nationalism.

People who are hyper-nationalistic and do treat American symbols like religious totems certainly can be found doing disrespectful things with those symbols, but to that, I'd point out that flag etiquette and the like is actually a really obscure topic and hard to follow down to every jot and tittle. The rules also can't help but come across as arbitrarily made-up. Ex-military types tend to understand it, but that's because it was an important topic in their profession at one time. When I see uber-patriots get all huffy about nationalistic symbols, but screw up treating them as tradition dictates, I think it's usually inadvertent and well-meaning. But that does speak to how silly their symbol worship can get.

[_SteelHead]

The pledge is nationalistic to the point of being worrisome. Down here in Texas after the pledge, the kids then do the pledge to the flag of Texas. I kid you not.

*Sigh*

[_EAllusion]

And what is going on with this Punisher skull flag? Apparently it refers to Police Swat.

Are we the baddies?

[_Kevin Graham]

The pledge is nationalistic to the point of being worrisome. Down here in Texas after the pledge, the kids then do the pledge to the flag of Texas. I kid you not.

*Sigh*

WTF??