Kavanaugh and Perjury

[_Some Schmo]

“Wow. The Republicans really nailed that.”

I see what you did there. : )

Heh. Freudian slip, I swear.

[_MeDotOrg]

Today was an American nightmare. In some ways this feels a little like the OJ Simpson trial, where guilt or innocence was loaded with a lot of social baggage.

The reason it is a nightmare for me is that I feel something for both sides. If you ask me based upon today what happened, I don't know. And not knowing is not guilty under the rule of law. If you are not sure of the testimony of the accuser or the defendant, the presumption of innocence goes to the defendant.

Kavanaugh has the self-righteousness arrogance of a Catholic school boy who always went along, and has never questioned himself or his values. But you also saw a man understandably exasperated by the way this process has unfolded.

Against that you have the testimony of Dr. Ford, which is both credible and inconsistent. As she herself explained, memory of traumatic events tends to concentrate on select details. But while that inconsistency is understandable within the context of a traumatic event, it makes it difficult to fully corroborate her story. So again, if this were a trial I would have to vote not guilty.

But again, this is not a trial, it is the confirmation hearing of a man who will spend a lifetime on the Supreme Court. Brett Kavanaugh will not go to jail if he is not confirmed. I know this has been an excruciating process, but I really think the proper thing to do would be to have the FBI investigate. It would show the women that the government was taking their accusations seriously, and it would give Kavanaugh a chance to be exonerated not by vote, but by investigation. Kavanaugh's confirmation will always be seen as horribly managed, but I think it would be even worse to not have the FBI fully investigate the charges. The uninvestigated allegations would always be a cloud over Kavanaugh's seat on the bench.

[_Xenophon]

Well, I just posted a character testimonial of friend and former NBA guy Chris Dudley in addition to Kavanaugh's testimony that suggests what you're outright stating probably wasn't the case? Would you have preferred he admit that he drank himself sick x-amount of times?

- Doc

In that same hearing are testimonies describing him as "incoherently drunk" and saying things like "it’s not credible for him to say that he had no memory lapses in the nights that he drank to excess" which doesn't even include the other stories that have come out about his college days (or the clearly addictive behaviors of Judge). I'm sure he is a good dude to a great many of people, I just find his attempts to downplay what were clearly days of heavy partying as disingenuous. Just as I would if I attempted to suggest I hadn't done that, despite claims from the people that I was spending most of my imbibing days with.

Again, I've stated how I came to my conclusion. Choose to accept it or not, you have the last word.

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

In that same hearing are testimonies describing him as "incoherently drunk" and saying things like "it’s not credible for him to say that he had no memory lapses in the nights that he drank to excess" which doesn't even include the other stories that have come out about his college days (or the clearly addictive behaviors of Judge). I'm sure he is a good dude to a great many of people, I just find his attempts to downplay what were clearly days of heavy partying as disingenuous. Just as I would if I attempted to suggest I hadn't done that, despite claims from the people that I was spending most of my imbibing days with.

Again, I've stated how I came to my conclusion. Choose to accept it or not, you have the last word.

I watched* the whole thing today, but it was a loooong hearing. *But I did have a few things to do and missed some portions here and there, so maybe I missed it. I'll google what you're saying to get a feel for what was said.

eta: I see a statement from a former roommate alleging he would be incoherently drunk and belligerent (perhaps when he would come back to their shared dorm room since they didn't spend time outside of it together?), but the gentleman who made the statement declined further interviews. Was this statement included at the hearing?

- Doc

[_EAllusion]

In that same hearing are testimonies describing him as "incoherently drunk" and saying things like "it’s not credible for him to say that he had no memory lapses in the nights that he drank to excess" which doesn't even include the other stories that have come out about his college days (or the clearly addictive behaviors of Judge). I'm sure he is a good dude to a great many of people, I just find his attempts to downplay what were clearly days of heavy partying as disingenuous. Just as I would if I attempted to suggest I hadn't done that, despite claims from the people that I was spending most of my imbibing days with.

Again, I've stated how I came to my conclusion. Choose to accept it or not, you have the last word.

I watched* the whole thing today, but it was a loooong hearing. *But I did have a few things to do and missed some portions here and there, so maybe I missed it. I'll google what you're saying to get a feel for what was said.

eta: I see a statement from a former roommate alleging he would be incoherently drunk and belligerent (perhaps when he would come back to their shared dorm room since they didn't spend time outside of it together?), but the gentleman who made the statement declined further interviews. Was this statement included at the hearing?

- Doc

They read in some of the testimonies of people who have described him as a hard drinker in contradiction to the choir boy image he tried to cultivate. It's not one person. There's a variety of sources that describe him that way. His yearbook defenses were also crazy-implausible to the point that it was bizarre.

[_EAllusion]

Huh. The WSJ is reporting that Kavanaugh closely watched Ford's testimony. That contradicts his claim he did not. Presumably there's a mistake in reporting there, otherwise that's lying on a Trumpian scale.

[_Brackite]

I am not really sure what to believe about this now. Is it a possibility that Kavanaugh could have done it, and he simply forgot about it from him being too drunk that night??

[_subgenius]

So, none of witnesses for Ford were corroborated, while Kavanaugh has a LOT of people testifying on various aspects of his behavior and character. I think it's worth noting.

- Doc

Doc,
these are the sort of posts and thinking that will have the Left sending you death threats.

[_Some Schmo]

I am not really sure what to believe about this now. Is it a possibility that Kavanaugh could have done it, and he simply forgot about it from him being too drunk that night??

I don't know.

I remember when I was in my early 20's I got drunk with my girlfriend and blacked out. When I woke up the next day, she wasn't there, and although I couldn't remember what happened, I had a very dark feeling about the night before.

I called her and was not surprised to find out we'd had a huge fight and she'd left very angry after a lot of yelling. I don't remember any of it, but I certainly had some of the residual emotion from the fight the next day. My brain couldn't remember it, but my heart could.

Here's the thing: there are some things that certain people won't do, no matter how drunk they get. However, if there are things you'd like to do but might need alcohol for the courage, you'd know that about yourself too.

Even if he couldn't remember this one incident, he knows if he'd be willing to do it in the right circumstances. His flat denial is basically saying, Not only have I never drunk enough to black out, I never was so drunk that I tried to rape a girl. Full stop. There's no nuance there.

[_Res Ipsa]

I am not really sure what to believe about this now. Is it a possibility that Kavanaugh could have done it, and he simply forgot about it from him being too drunk that night??

Yes, that’s a way to reconcile their testimony.