Trump whistleblower complaint

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_Icarus
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Re: Trump whistleblower complaint

Post by _Icarus »

subgenius wrote: Secret Service selected location from among several possible locations. Ergo, Trump didn't schedule, but perhaps i haven't seen the evidence you oresume to have.


Trump was pimping his resort for the G7 back in August: https://Twitter.com/atrupar/status/1165 ... 12353?s=20
"One of the hardest things for me to accept is the fact that Kevin Graham has blonde hair, blue eyes and an English last name. This ugly truth blows any arguments one might have for actual white supremacism out of the water. He's truly a disgrace." - Ajax
_canpakes
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Re: Trump whistleblower complaint

Post by _canpakes »

subgenius wrote:
canpakes wrote:Maybe folks are just mimicking the example of your own criteria regarding Democrats over the years.

Sooo, you're validating that criteria? ok, seems legit.

I neither validate it, nor not. And you’re the fellow taking issue with it.


canpakes wrote:But Trump scheduling the G7 at his Doral resort, as example, gets us a lot closer than any of your past criteria.

how so? Secret Service selected location from among several possible locations. Ergo, Trump didn't schedule, but perhaps i haven't seen the evidence you oresume to have.

Then you’ll assert absolutely pure coincidence that the summit will be scheduled at a resort owned by the President. That’s your prerogative. You should stick with that defense.


As does his request for foreign governments to concoct ‘corruption’ claims against other folks, for his own political gain. ; )

Yep, that video of Biden seems like it was staged by Trump, you have some sound footing here, for sure.

Hey, you still got nothin’ here, aside from Trump ‘looking for corruption’ in only one strangely specific situation, where it doesn’t exist, hoping that a foreign government will concoct some in exchange for aid, and against a political rival.

Another amazing coincidence. ; )
_Icarus
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Re: Trump whistleblower complaint

Post by _Icarus »

Bill Taylor drops a bomb:

"Amb. Sondland told me that President Trump had told him that he wants President [Volodymyr] Zelensky to state publicly that Ukraine will investigate Burisma and alleged Ukrainian interference in the 2016 election."

Check, and mate.

But tomorrow the news will be all about Gabbard and Hillary.... again.
"One of the hardest things for me to accept is the fact that Kevin Graham has blonde hair, blue eyes and an English last name. This ugly truth blows any arguments one might have for actual white supremacism out of the water. He's truly a disgrace." - Ajax
_SteelHead
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Re: Trump whistleblower complaint

Post by _SteelHead »

I am guessing the house will move to send an Impeachment Resolution to the senate shortly.


The senate will be interesting - see if old politicians will put values above party.
It is better to be a warrior in a garden, than a gardener at war.

Some of us, on the other hand, actually prefer a religion that includes some type of correlation with reality.
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_Chap
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Re: Trump whistleblower complaint

Post by _Chap »

Icarus wrote:Bill Taylor drops a bomb:

"Amb. Sondland told me that President Trump had told him that he wants President [Volodymyr] Zelensky to state publicly that Ukraine will investigate Burisma and alleged Ukrainian interference in the 2016 election."

Check, and mate.

But tomorrow the news will be all about Gabbard and Hillary.... again.


Download the PDF of Ambassador William B. Taylor's opening statement here:

https://games-cdn.washingtonpost.com/no ... 714783.pdf

The whole document is a multi-barrelled smoking gun showing the President's grossly improper use of his powers for personal political ends, with no regard for the national interests of the US or (as usual) of a US ally, and to the dismay of the career diplomats who watch this happening and see how disgraceful and damaging for the US Trump's behaviour is.

But here are some extracts (I have added the bold emphasis; I have OCRd the PDF and have not corrected all the resultant glitches):

Page 1:

Opening Statement of Ambassador William B. Taylor - October 22, 2019
Mr. Chairman, I appreciate the opportunity to appear today to provide my
perspective on the events that are the subject of the Committees' inquiry. My sole
purpose is to provide the Committees with my views about the strategic
importance of Ukraine to the United States as well as additional information about
the incidents in question.

I have dedicated my life to serving U.S. interests at home and abroad in both
military and civilian roles. My background and experience are nonpartisan and I
have been honored to serve under every administration, Republican and
Democratic, since 1985.

For 50 years, I have served the country, starting as a cadet at West Point, then as an
infantry officer for six years, including with the 101' Airborne Division in
Vietnam; then at the Department of Energy; then as a member of a Senate staff;
then at NATO; then with the State Depaiiment here and abroadin Afghanistan,
Iraq, Jerusalem, and Ukraine; and more recently, as Executive Vice President of
the nonpartisan United States Institute of Peace.

While I have served in many places and in different capacities, I have a particular
interest in and respect for the importance of our country's relationship with
Ukraine. Our national security demands that this relationship remain strong.
However, in August and September of this year, I became increasingly concerned
that our relationship with Ukraine was being fundamentally undermined by an
irregular, informal channel of U.S. policy-making and by the withholding of vital
security assistance for domestic political reasons. I hope my remarks today will
help the Committees understand why I believed that to be the case.
At the outset, I would like to convey several key points. First, Ukraine is a
strategic partner of the United States, important for the security of our country as
well as Europe. Second, Ukraine is, right at this momentwhile we sit in this
roomand for the last five years, under armed attack from Russia. Third, the
security assistance we provide is crucial to Ukraine's defense against Russian
aggression, and, more importantly, sends a signal to Ukrainiansand Russians
that we are Ukraine's reliable strategic partner. And finally, as the Committees are
now aware, I said on September 9 in a message to Ambassador Gordon Sondland
that withholding security assistance in exchange for help with a domestic political
campaign in the United States would be "crazy." I believed that then, and I still
believe that.


Pages 10-11:

On September 1, just three days after my cable to Secretary Pompeo, President
Zelenskyy met Vice President Pence at a bilateral meeting in Warsaw. President
Trump had planned to travel to Warsaw but at the last minute had cancelled
because of Hurricane Dorian. Just hours before the Pence-Zelenskyy meeting, I
contacted Mr. Danyliuk to let him know that the delay of U.S. security assistance
was an "all or nothing" proposition, in the sense that if the White House did not lift
the hold prior to the end of the fiscal year (September 30), the funds would expire
and Ukraine would receive nothing. I was hopeful that at the bilateral meeting or
shortly thereafter, the White House would lift the hold, but this was not to be.
Indeed, I received a readout of the Pence-Zelenskyy meeting over the phone from
Mr. Morrison, during which he told me President Zelenskyy had opened the
meeting by asking the Vice President about security cooperation. The Vice
President did not respond substantively, but said that he would talk to President
Trump that night. The Vice President did say that President Trump wanted the
Europeans to do more to support Ukraine and that he wanted the Ukrainians to do
more to fight corruption.

During this same phone call I had with Mr. Morrison, he went on to describe a
conversation Ambassador Sondland had with Mr. Yermak at Warsaw.
Ambassador Sondland told Mr. Yermak that the security assistance money would
not come until President Zelenskyy committed to pursue the Burisma investigation.
I was alarmed by what Mr. Morrison told me about the Sondland-Yermak

conversation. This was the first time I had heard that the security assistancenot
just the White House meetingwas conditioned on the investigations.
Very concerned, on that same day I sent Ambassador Sondland a text message
asking if "we [are] now saying that security assistance and [a] White House meeting are
conditioned on investigations?" Ambassador Sondland responded asking me to
call him, which I did. During that phone call, Ambassador Sondland told me that
President Trump had told him that he wants President Zelenskyy to state publicly
that Ukraine will investigate Burisma and alleged Ukrainian interference in the
2016 U.S. election.

Ambassador Sondland also told me that he now recognized that he had made a
mistake by earlier telling the Ukrainian officials to whom he spoke that a White
House meeting with President Zelenskyy was dependent on a public announcement
of investigationsin fact, Ambassador Sondland said, "everything" was dependent
on such an announcement, including security assistance. He said that President
Trump wanted President Zelenskyy "in a public box" by making a public statement
about ordering such investigations.
Zadok:
I did not have a faith crisis. I discovered that the Church was having a truth crisis.
Maksutov:
That's the problem with this supernatural stuff, it doesn't really solve anything. It's a placeholder for ignorance.
_Analytics
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Re: Trump whistleblower complaint

Post by _Analytics »

Here is a link to the New York Times article about Bill Taylor's testimony.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/22/us/t ... e=Homepage

According to the article:

Mr. Taylor’s testimony directly contradicted repeated assertions by Mr. Trump and his Republican allies that there was never a direct linkage involving investigations into Burisma, a Ukrainian gas company that employed Hunter Biden, the former vice president’s son, or other Democrats.

It also raised questions about the veracity of the testimony of other prominent impeachment witnesses, including Mr. Sondland and Kurt D. Volker, the special envoy to Ukraine, who have said behind closed doors they had not been aware of any improper pressure tactics.

That is not true, Mr. Taylor told the committee. He said the president had explicitly made it clear that Ukraine’s president, Volodymyr Zelensky, would not be invited to the White House or secure much-needed security aid unless the Ukrainian leader made a public announcement that his country would start the investigations that Mr. Trump so badly wanted.
Mr. Taylor testified that he was told of Mr. Trump’s demands for investigations during a telephone call with Mr. Sondland.
“Ambassador Sondland said that ‘everything’ was dependent on such an announcement, including security assistance,” Mr. Taylor told lawmakers on Monday. “He said that President Trump wanted president Zelensky ‘in a public box’ by making a public statement about ordering such investigations.”


“During that phone call,” Mr. Taylor said, “Ambassador Sondland told me that President Trump had told him that he wants President Zelensky to state publicly that Ukraine will investigate Burisma and alleged Ukrainian interference in the 2016 U.S. election.”


Taylor's 15-page statement explains what happened in detail. While on one side Trump's puppet master Putin is invading Ukraine and a new, non-corrupt government is coming into power and desperately needs to signal to Russia that its military aggression will not be tolerated, Trump clearly and emphatically communicated to Ukraine that he wouldn't give them the validity a meeting with the President would convey OR give them the military aid that everybody agreed they desperately needed unless Zelensky personally and publicly made a statement about investigating Biden. Amazing.

Trump is a treasonous douchebag.
It’s relatively easy to agree that only Homo sapiens can speak about things that don’t really exist, and believe six impossible things before breakfast. You could never convince a monkey to give you a banana by promising him limitless bananas after death in monkey heaven.

-Yuval Noah Harari
_Chap
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Re: Trump whistleblower complaint

Post by _Chap »

Analytics wrote:Taylor's 15-page statement explains what happened in detail.


See the link to the pdf of his statement and the extracts given in my preceding post.

It is good to read Ambassador Taylor's actual words at length.

But the TL;DR is of course succinctly summed up by:

Analytics wrote:Trump is a treasonous douchebag.
Zadok:
I did not have a faith crisis. I discovered that the Church was having a truth crisis.
Maksutov:
That's the problem with this supernatural stuff, it doesn't really solve anything. It's a placeholder for ignorance.
_canpakes
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Re: Trump whistleblower complaint

Post by _canpakes »

SteelHead wrote:The senate will be interesting - see if old politicians will put values above party.

Not if there’s an ‘R’ after their name.
_MeDotOrg
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Re: Trump whistleblower complaint

Post by _MeDotOrg »

When the details of the testimony from all of the witnesses are finally pieced together, coupled with the public utterances of Mick Mulvaney and the President's transcript of his call with Zelensky, I'm not sure how a reasonable person would determine that a quid pro quo did not take place.

The President has compared his treatment to a lynching. "You people with this phony emoluments clause", Trump told reporters before a cabinet meeting, talking about his decision to withdraw Doral as next year's G7 site.

If Leon Jaworski found a 'smoking gun' in the form of Nixon's tapes, if what we hear is confirmed, Congress has found a smoking gun, the shell casings with fingerprints, the reloading press, the gunpowder scale and dispenser, and directions to the effing mine where they got the niter to make the gunpowder.

Expect the nightly news to be a montage of GOP congressmen doing the corridor power-walk, looking straight ahead and not taking any questions.
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_EAllusion
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Re: Trump whistleblower complaint

Post by _EAllusion »

It's a little worse than I thought and what I thought was already extremely bad. I can only imagine what's gone on in all the other diplomatic calls they violated the law to hide. There's approximately zero chance there isn't blood-curdling stuff in there.

Trump has to go. Even if that did make Republicans a shoe-in for 2020 (which it doesn't), Trump has to go. Decent people have to do everything they can to make that happen. Trump's name should become the modern update for situations we customarily use Benedict Arnold.
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