The Mopologists Fantasize About "A Totally Different Morality"

[_Everybody Wang Chung]

Dr. Scratch,

Excellent OP.

I remember not too long ago Coach Peterson posted a very strange article at SeN about how you really don’t have to forgive people.

I believe he was attempting to justify why he holds grudges for so long. Truly bizarre morality.

[_Doctor Scratch]

Dr. Moore:

I hope you've noticed that Dr. Peterson has been going ballistic over your criticism, repeating again and again his new passive-aggressive mantra:

I'm trying to think of any ways in which the influx of posters (and of up- and down-voters) from your most excellent message board (to criticize which would instantly reveal me as a person of low character) has improved the conversation here.

I probably won't respond. Not in real time, anyway. I'm less interested in a never-ending back-and-forth with the charming residents of your marvelous board (which it would be a horrific act of bad character on my part ever to fault) than I can possibly express. That way lies nothing but exasperation and possible madness.

Etc., etc. Getting called out as a liar really seems to have set him off.

[_Dr Moore]

Well, “marvelous” is an adjective oft used in reference to the founding of Mormonism, the work and wonder of the restoration, is it not? Even cloaked in sarcasm, I choose to hear a hint of acknowledgment of truth sneaking out there. It IS a marvelous thing, to create and manage a place where adults can sort through a broad range of ideas related to Mormonism. And Mormonism is super interesting, as are it’s leaders and ardent scholarly defenders.

I want to posit that the vitality of MDB has absolutely nothing to do with Dr. P per se. He simply draws a majority of the fire, BY CHOICE, because:

(a) he used to post regularly here, for years, therefore has contentious history with many of you, but more importantly
(b) he out-writes blog/board posts by a factor of 100 to 1,000 times more than any other Mopologist or church leader. He is in a league of one, when it comes to volume. Think about that — even if we were to carefully track and control for equal time relative to online content posted, Dan Peterson would still find his name on a majority of current, topical conversations. His combative, tireless approach to blogs and boards only cements that reality.

Imagine if Dallin Oaks began blogging and boarding 6 hours every day, or if young Smoot were to raise his game to a Mopologist-leading 7 blog posts per day and 30-50 board comments per day, well I am confident they both would quickly overtake Dr. P in raw mentions and “attacks” — if attack is defined as critical content analysis.

By the way, I wonder if anyone would dare try to challenge Dr. P’s literal running of the table? If someone in the Mopolgetics community tried, would it piss him off to lose the spotlight? He sure seems committed to receiving as much attention (to be sure, he all but invites negative attention, the way he writes to provoke critics into a fight) ... But, AT WHAT COST??

Anyway, this isn’t a sewer, a sty, a stalker board or anything of the sort. Dr. Dan showing up in so many threads is simple math, law of large numbers, a function of his own carpet bombing the Internet with a simply mind boggling amount of controversial Mormonism-linked commentary.

Thanks, Dr Shades, and other helpers, such as Dean Robbers, for keeping the site going and for playing the long game by encouraging diversity of views and personalities here.

And I do hope Dr. P will choose to address people as people, and leave out all of the negative reference to MDB. As he promised.

[_Dr Moore]

On further reflection, I have to wonder what BYU administrators might do when presented with evidence that a tenured professor had entered into a very public, very specific, fund raising agreement — a contract — to benefit the Interpreter, a non-scholarly side hobby, no less, in demonstrably bad faith. What do you all think?

The evidence is all out in the open: the context, the deal, the agreements by both parties. I can easily provide direct evidence of the donated funds. And moreover, because all of the clarifying email correspondence was conducted ON BYU EMAIL, an investigation would turn up ample evidence of the existence of the contract, of my part being gratefully acknowledged by Dr. Peterson, and of my numerous subsequent warnings that he had acted and continued to act in bad faith afterward. And to top it all off, of course, there is the almost 7 months of direct evidence of his near-daily wanton violations, indulgence really, in the one specific thing he contracted not to do: making public negative references to MDB.

I have to say, while I prefer to err on the side of generosity with people, Dan’s behavior has me thinking that words are cheap, and that turning him in to administrators and honor code office might be in the best interest of all BYU stakeholders. It might end up being the best thing for Dr. P as well, a sort of intervention on professional accountability.

[_Philo Sofee]

What a fantastic enterprise this entire thing has been, and the wonderful way you have professionally and ethically handled yourself Dr. Moore. To me it demonstrates that to defend Mormonism even if one has to become immoral, childish, and unethical, it is the noble thing to do. That is how Peterson and Midget and Kiwi57 come across to all others except themselves. In their eyes they will be invited onto Jesus' lap and given a pat on the head for sharing the Savior's "love" with all his other children. They are morally superior by being immorally unethical. It boggles the mind.

[_Dr. Shades]

On further reflection, I have to wonder what BYU administrators might do when presented with evidence that a tenured professor had entered into a very public, very specific, fund raising agreement — a contract — to benefit the Interpreter, a non-scholarly side hobby, no less, in demonstrably bad faith. What do you all think? . . . turning him in to administrators and honor code office might be in the best interest of all BYU stakeholders. It might end up being the best thing for Dr. P as well, a sort of intervention on professional accountability.

NO. NO. A THOUSAND TIMES, NO.

My goal for MormonDiscussions.com is that the discussions that take place here NOT EVER bleed over into anyone's real life. I want nobody's marriage, relationships, employment, or ecclesiastical standing to be jeopardized IN ANY WAY by the things that are discussed here, NO MATTER HOW TENUOUS THE CONNECTION. Why? Because if everyone concludes that the things they say here can be used by an intellectual opponent to cause actual, lasting damage in the real world, then everyone will immediately clam up and free discussion will come to a screeching halt.

By contrast, if everyone knows that there will be no real-world consequences to the things they say, then they will speak freely and reveal their true opinions. . . and thus allow free speech, and this website, to continue to thrive.

Besides, snitching to people's tenure committees (as Tvednes did to Murphy's), snitching to people's department heads (as Midgley did to Kishkumen's), and calling a guy's sister to demand dirt on him (as Midgley did to Murphy's) in order to end their careers is a filthy trick that the Mopologists employ, not us disbelievers.

[_moksha]

NO. NO. A THOUSAND TIMES, NO.

Bravo to Dr. Shades. Let's not have discussions here become part of "the evil that men do".

[_Doctor Scratch]

On further reflection, I have to wonder what BYU administrators might do when presented with evidence that a tenured professor had entered into a very public, very specific, fund raising agreement — a contract — to benefit the Interpreter, a non-scholarly side hobby, no less, in demonstrably bad faith. What do you all think?

The evidence is all out in the open: the context, the deal, the agreements by both parties. I can easily provide direct evidence of the donated funds. And moreover, because all of the clarifying email correspondence was conducted ON BYU EMAIL, an investigation would turn up ample evidence of the existence of the contract, of my part being gratefully acknowledged by Dr. Peterson, and of my numerous subsequent warnings that he had acted and continued to act in bad faith afterward. And to top it all off, of course, there is the almost 7 months of direct evidence of his near-daily wanton violations, indulgence really, in the one specific thing he contracted not to do: making public negative references to MDB.

I have to say, while I prefer to err on the side of generosity with people, Dan’s behavior has me thinking that words are cheap, and that turning him in to administrators and honor code office might be in the best interest of all BYU stakeholders. It might end up being the best thing for Dr. P as well, a sort of intervention on professional accountability.

Dr. Moore:

Have you seen what the Mopologists are saying about this? Check it out:

Kiwi57: "You mean - the one that you'd have to be horribly cruel and mean-spirited to criticise in any way?"

Yes. That one. (My character is under serious attack at the moment because I've maligned that lovely place here and allowed others, notably including you and Professor Midgley, to refer to it disrespectfully. One person has proposed to take the issue to the BYU administration, in hopes of seeing me disciplined.)

One person has proposed to take the issue to the BYU administration, in hopes of seeing me disciplined.

That sounds like something a certain poster I know might think of as a way to make himself look important and "connected."

It's someone in whom I'm very disappointed.

Gee whiz, Dr. Moore--didn't you donate, like, $1,000 to Interpreter? And this is the thanks--and disrespect--that you get in return?

[_Philo Sofee]

And thus we see that the Mormons will do whatever it takes in order to come out looking good and moral and upright.....in their own eyes to each other. It is why I happily quit, and have gained in happiness ever since. I have far better relationships and friendships now than I ever did as a Mormon, seriously. And I am sure I know the reason why. Their morality is of a different order and is the utmost heinous.

[_Dr Moore]

Some people refuse to allow themselves to be held accountable for their actions. Some people prefer to blame shift until the earth is scorched.

Dr. P is free to be "very disappointed" in me, but I ask you all, disappointed at what, exactly? The contract he made was real. The money was real. And his bad faith was also real. He is the chronic alcoholic who blames everyone else for his alcoholism, but will never stay in rehab.

Grow up, Dr. Peterson.

I wonder if Midgley and McGregor would be "very disappointed" if they saw what sorts of things Dr. Peterson says about them, and their message board behaviors, behind their backs?

Just wondering...