Thread for discussing climate change

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Gunnar
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Re: Thread for discussing climate change

Post by Gunnar »

Real-World Study Shows That Certain Trucking Segments Are Ready to Go Electric and Save 100 Million Metric Tons of CO2

The main thing standing in the way of realizing RMI's goals is the adamant opposition of the wealthy and politically powerful fossil fuel industry, due to all too obvious, self-serving avarice.

Yet, some fossil fuel companies, like BP are reading the handwriting on the wall and are beginning to advocate transition away from dependence on fossil fuels. BP report: Oil is dying, long live green energy
The report looks at three scenarios to explore energy transition to 2050. BP writes that “the scenarios help to illustrate the range of outcomes possible over the next 30 years, ‎although the uncertainty is substantial and the scenarios do not provide a comprehensive ‎description of all possible outcomes.‎”

BP’s three scenarios are Rapid Transition (carbon emissions from energy use to fall by around 70% by 2050), Net Zero (carbon emissions from energy use fall by ‎over 95% by 2050), and Business-as-usual (emissions in 2050 less than 10% below 2018 levels). But what unites all three scenarios is this:

As a result of these policies and shifts in societal preferences, there is a decline in the share of ‎hydrocarbons (coal, oil, and natural gas) in the global energy system in all three scenarios. This is ‎matched by a corresponding increase in the role of renewable energy as the world increasingly ‎electrifies. The scale of this shift varies significantly across the three scenarios, with the share of ‎hydrocarbons in primary energy declining from around 85% in 2018 to between 70-20% by 2050 ‎and the share of renewable energy increasing to between 20-60%.‎

In BP’s first two scenarios, COVID-19 accelerates the slowdown in oil consumption, leading to it peaking last year. In its Business-as-usual scenario, oil demand peaks by 2030.

BP chief economist Spencer Dale said:

[The energy transition] would be an unprecedented event. Never in modern history has the demand for any traded fuel declined in absolute terms.

[Meanwhile,] the share of renewable energy grows more quickly than any fuel ever seen in history.

Electrek’s Take
Let’s just take a minute to fully absorb the enormity of this report: BP is a global oil giant. And it is stating that fossil fuels will be replaced by green energy such as wind, solar, and hydropower because oil has reached its peak as a result of the pandemic.

So it’s no surprise, as Electrek reported September 11, that BP invested $1.1 billion in offshore wind in the US. It’s good environmental sense. It’s good business sense. BP isn’t being benevolent; it knows that’s where the market is going.
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Re: Thread for discussing climate change

Post by Gunnar »

Cultellus wrote:
Tue Oct 05, 2021 6:00 am
Image

Hell Pizza wants Greta to have a pizza.
I'm sure Greta wouldn't mind going to that Hell! :lol:

Here is another Hell she probably wouldn't mind going to.
The village of Hell has become a minor tourist attraction because of its name, as visitors often have their photograph taken in front of the station sign. A smaller building on the railway station has been given the sign Gods-expedition, which is the archaic spelling of the word for "goods handling". (godsekspedisjon would be the spelling in the contemporary Norwegian language).

The name Hell stems from the Old Norse word hellir, which means "overhang" or "cliff cave". It has a more used homonym in modern Norwegian that means "luck". The Old Norse word Hel is the same as today's English Hell, and as a proper noun, Hel was the ruler of Hel. In modern Norwegian the word for hell is helvete.[3]

Among English-speaking tourists, popular postcards depict the station with a heavy frost on the ground, making a visual joke about "Hell frozen over".[4] Temperatures in Hell can reach −25 °C (−13 °F)[2] during winter.

British punk band The Boys recorded their third album in the village, and as a result named it To Hell with the Boys.[5
No precept or claim is more suspect or more likely to be false than one that can only be supported by invoking the claim of Divine authority for it--no matter who or what claims such authority.
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Re: Thread for discussing climate change

Post by Chap »

Atlanticmike wrote:
Tue Oct 05, 2021 1:33 am
Chap wrote:
Mon Oct 04, 2021 8:59 pm


And your say-so on this point is decisive ... why?

Naaah. I'll stick with the climate specialists who use the science I learned by years of hard work, and my own judgement formed by reading the evidence freely available for criticism .

The roofers? Sorry, in comparison they just don't carry much weight in such matters.
I'm happy for you! You keep believin those "climate specialist" till the day u die! You'll die happy I'm sure. Unless you don't know how to swim because any day now we are all going to be under water according to the "climate specialist", didn't u watch docs cool little video?
You're getting me wrong A-m. I am not just poor little ignorant me faced with two sources of authority, and having to choose between them. I have a good understanding of how the basic science underpinning climate science works, because I worked hard to learn it (and that was no easy matter, although I had the benefit of doing so at one of the world's top universities). Furthermore, I can read research reports on the field and am capable of understanding them at a sufficient, though non-expert, level. So I am not just acccepting anybody's unsupported word for it.

When the world's first scientific society (The Royal Society of London for Improving Natural Knowledge, as it was called then) was founded in London in 1660, it choose as its motto the Latin phrase 'Nullius in Verba' , meaning 'Don't take anybody's word for it'. That's still built into the basic training of a science student: X says something is true, so he tells us what evidence he bases that on - then other scientists check his evidence for themselves to see if they come to the same conclusion. There are no prophets in science, and no church whose word must be accepted uncritically. That's about as far from a cult as you can get.

Just imagine that a guy like me suddenly started telling you that the standards for designing and installing roofing frames were all wrong, and that collar beams and rafter ties were unnecessary, and people who used them in roof construction were in a cult. Would you pay me a moment's attention? Nope. Because you know how that stuff works, and I have no training or experience in roofing.

More or less the same applies to you telling me about climate science.
Maksutov:
That's the problem with this supernatural stuff, it doesn't really solve anything. It's a placeholder for ignorance.
Mayan Elephant:
Not only have I denounced the Big Lie, I have denounced the Big lie big lie.
Gunnar
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Re: Thread for discussing climate change

Post by Gunnar »

Chap wrote:
Tue Oct 05, 2021 8:25 am
More or less the same applies to you telling me about climate science.
Chap, you keep forgetting that democracy means that AM's ignorance is just as good as your hard won education and knowledge. :roll: Of course, that doesn't apply when comparing your relative ignorance about roofing with his knowledge and expertise about roofing. Right? Yet, I would bet that you would be more competent as a DIY roofer than he would be as a climate or any other kind of scientist or mathematician.
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Physics Guy
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Re: Thread for discussing climate change

Post by Physics Guy »

A lot of people might just worry about climate change because it's trendy, but some of us actually understand the issues more deeply than that. For instance I'm a physics professor. I don't just have a PhD: I create them. And the sad truth about human-driven climate change is that it is indeed true. I was skeptical myself—in the early 1990s. Debate has been over for decades. Denialism is crap.

If someone makes a mistaken scientific criticism I'll try to straighten them out, but if people just rant about "the cult of Greta" or something then I just ignore them the way I'd ignore a loud drunk. That stuff can only sound clever if you have absolutely no grasp of the subject, and the irony of ignorance complaining that other people are ignorant was only cute the first time. By now it too is banal.

Read it and weep.
I was a teenager before it was cool.
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Xenophon
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Re: Thread for discussing climate change

Post by Xenophon »

Physics Guy wrote:
Tue Oct 05, 2021 11:12 am
If someone makes a mistaken scientific criticism I'll try to straighten them out, but if people just rant about "the cult of Greta" or something then I just ignore them the way I'd ignore a loud drunk. That stuff can only sound clever if you have absolutely no grasp of the subject, and the irony of ignorance complaining that other people are ignorant was only cute the first time. By now it too is banal.
The comical part is I doubt I would even recognize Greta if it wasn't for folks like AM, I'm still certain I don't know what her voice sounds like. I suppose if one can't argue against Nobel winners she serves as a decent enough punching bag but it isn't that impressive to me.
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Gunnar
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Re: Thread for discussing climate change

Post by Gunnar »

Why have climate change predictions been so WRONG?
In this video I wanted to address a common talking point - why have climate change predictions been so wrong? Year after year predictions are made that have no basis in reality, so why - especially in the aftermath of the latest IPCC report - should we trust climate scientists? In particular James Hansen and his prediction in 1988 didn't turn out so well, did it?
Well, as it turns out, there's a very good reason. Because they're right most of the time, and their predictions, including those of the IPCC, have been borne out by reality. Sorry lol.

REFERENCES
(1) https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com ... 19GL085378
(2) https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/2270237/
(3) WG1 AR6 https://www.ipcc.ch/assessment-report/ar6/
(4) This figure originally taken from https://skepticalscience.com/Hansen-198 ... vanced.htm
(5) Oreskes, N., & Conway, E. M. (2010). Merchants of doubt: how a handful of scientists obscured the truth on issues from tobacco smoke to global warming. New York: Bloomsbury Press.
Skeptics of global warming are very fond of pointing out that the climate scientists predictions are often wrong. What they conveniently and deceptively fail to mention is that these predictions more often under predict the magnitude and rapidity of the changes than over predict it.
Last edited by Gunnar on Tue Oct 05, 2021 12:56 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Thread for discussing climate change

Post by Gunnar »

Physics Guy wrote:
Tue Oct 05, 2021 11:12 am
A lot of people might just worry about climate change because it's trendy, but some of us actually understand the issues more deeply than that. For instance I'm a physics professor. I don't just have a PhD: I create them. And the sad truth about human-driven climate change is that it is indeed true. I was skeptical myself—in the early 1990s. Debate has been over for decades. Denialism is crap.
But you keep ignoring the commonly accepted fundamental concept that democracy means that others' ignorance is just as good as your PhD: ;)
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Re: Thread for discussing climate change

Post by canpakes »

Xenophon wrote:
Tue Oct 05, 2021 11:25 am
The comical part is I doubt I would even recognize Greta …

She has very distinctive eyes.

Image
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Re: Thread for discussing climate change

Post by Xenophon »

canpakes wrote:
Tue Oct 05, 2021 12:57 pm
Xenophon wrote:
Tue Oct 05, 2021 11:25 am
The comical part is I doubt I would even recognize Greta …

She has very distinctive eyes.
I may now have water all over my computer screen. I was not prepared for that lol when I opened your message :lol:
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