Actual Ex-Mo Predators

[Marcus]

http://mormonrosebud.wikidot.com/inurement-warnings

Thank you, I had forgotten that conversation. Wow. The argument that both jd and Rosebud were "fired" to solve the problem is even weaker now. The board just manipulated the situation.

[Kishkumen]

Thank you, I had forgotten that conversation. Wow. The argument that both John Dehlin and Rosebud were "fired" to solve the problem is even weaker now. The board just manipulated the situation.

At every turn it looks like Open Stories Foundation was trying to remain a viable organization. In the end, they were successful, and Open Stories Foundation has remained viable. Nothing sinister about that.

[Dwight]

Thank you, I had forgotten that conversation. Wow. The argument that both John Dehlin and Rosebud were "fired" to solve the problem is even weaker now. The board just manipulated the situation.

This is pure Monday morning quarterbacking.

You are implying that Joanna Brooks was just a token rubber stamp enabling John. Why did she quit the board if she was ready to just rubber stamp whatever JD wanted to do?

[Meadowchik]

Exmormons need to face something. We have left a church built on polygamy and even post-living-polygamy, the church still remains the culture and structure that enabled coercive Mormon polygamy. Furthermore leaving the church doesn't mean we have left polygamy culture behind. We need to have a long serious think about how to shed polygamy culture in exmormon spaces and how to warn each other better. People have been warning about BK for years. But just like predators in a Mormon ward, BK kept finding new people who didn't know or didn't understand the warnings.

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

Thank you, I had forgotten that conversation. Wow. The argument that both John Dehlin and Rosebud were "fired" to solve the problem is even weaker now. The board just manipulated the situation.

.. Nothing sinister about that.

Other than giving JD top coverage for engaging in a sexual relationship with a subordinate.

- Doc

[drumdude]

.. Nothing sinister about that.

Other than giving John Dehlin top coverage for engaging in a sexual relationship with a subordinate.

- Doc

If anyone has information that the board hasn’t rubber stamped everything Dehlin has wanted I’d love to see it.

[Kishkumen]

Other than giving John Dehlin top coverage for engaging in a sexual relationship with a subordinate.

A more realistic view is that it was a messy situation, John was wrong to do what he did, The board handled it in a far from ideal way, and Open Stories Foundation was lucky to survive. I think it is a net positive that Open Stories Foundation did survive, and I am inclined to think that its health and survival depended in part on removing Rosebud from the equation. She is not just ANY person who had a consensual sexual relationship with her superior; she is the one who willingly and voluntarily carried on an office affair, planned an internal coup when caught, tried to get John to go along, and failed.

Since that time she has sought to undermine or, to the best of her ability, destroy John Dehlin and Open Stories Foundation. This includes parking on this board for years spinning lie after lie, fantasy after fantasy, about the whole thing.

Remove every other variable from the equation, and this is not the kind of person who leads a healthy organization that is successful and surviving far into the future. This is not the kind of employee who is good for an organization. Rosebud's firing was most likely a net positive for Open Stories Foundation. The situation with Kamp is much the same, except that Dehlin is much less culpable in it.

[jpatterson]

This is why, years ago, I brought up rape culture to this board and was summarily laughed out of here. I brought up the need to "start by believing," to give people space and empathy to tell their story rather than DEMANDING PROOF.

This board, by and large, has been a case study in how NOT to handle accusations of abuse.

But, we can all learn.

Your participation in this debacle warranted skepticism. To this day we have no way of knowing the degree to which the interactions between Rosebud and Dehlin were consensual or not. She made claims about lack of consent. The evidence did not back her up.

In this way, I think the board comes out smelling like a rose. People here were right to be skeptical of Rosebud's claims. At the same time, I think the board functions in a way that maximizes Rosebud's ability to tell her story. Some people just don't care for how the same structures allow people to disagree with her and question her story.

You continue to demonstrate your complete lack of understanding when it comes to the issue of sexual assault, why victims struggle to come forward, why victims struggle to even see their assault as assault until years later and why it's so damn easy, because of attitudes like yours, for perpetrators to get away with it. Victims believe that if they don't have hard-clad evidence, there is no point in reporting. Because of attitudes of people like you.

It would really be interesting to be a fly on the wall when/if a loved one of yours came to you (god forbid) claiming to be assaulted and what would result from you taking a hard line of "Well if I don't see evidence, it didn't happen!" Let me know how that works out for you.

[Kishkumen]

You continue to demonstrate your complete lack of understanding when it comes to the issue of sexual assault, why victims struggle to come forward, why victims struggle to even see their assault as assault until years later and why it's so damn easy, because of attitudes like yours, for perpetrators to get away with it. Victims believe that if they don't have hard-clad evidence, there is no point in reporting. Because of attitudes of people like you.

It would really be interesting to be a fly on the wall when/if a loved one of yours came to you (god forbid) claiming to be assaulted and what would result from you taking a hard line of "Well if I don't see evidence, it didn't happen!" Let me know how that works out for you.

You continue to show a lack of priorities and extremism that would have made you much more valuable in the Chinese Cultural Revolution than today in the U.S.

[drumdude]

"Well if I don't see evidence, it didn't happen!" Let me know how that works out for you.

The problem is we have seen the evidence, the evidence that you and Rosebud posted online. And it doesn't support Rosebud's version of events.