Calling it "Politically Motivated"

[canpakes]

From CNN today. Heard Island. Tell you what those Penguins are gonna by golly pay up, too.

https://www.cnn.com/2025/04/03/us/video ... iff-digvid

[Chap]

From CNN today. Heard Island. Tell you what those Penguins are gonna by golly pay up, too.

https://www.cnn.com/2025/04/03/us/video ... iff-digvid

I'd like to hear from Moksha on this one ... is he in touch with his relations down there?

[Jersey Girl]

From CNN today. Heard Island. Tell you what those Penguins are gonna by golly pay up, too.

https://www.cnn.com/2025/04/03/us/video ... iff-digvid

I'd like to hear from Moksha on this one ... is he in touch with his relations down there?

In touch with them? He's with them now. You didn't hear? He was deported and airlifted to Heard Island. Can't fly you know.

[Markk]

Markk, I understand your position. I just don’t agree that tariffs provide the solution that you claim they do. They’ll immediately impose greater costs across the board on consumables for every stressed middle-class family, if that’s who you’re concerned about, with absolutely no guarantee that any significant portion of those families will be able to locate your hoped-for but presently-nonexistent ‘good paying manufacturing jobs’ that are years down the road if they arrive at all, in extremely limited locations.

Meanwhile, you still have healthcare insurance, transportation, childcare and housing costs to contend with … if you are actually concerned with the viability of our middle class. I keep asking you to consider those. In turn, you keep dodging and harping on ‘what are the Democrats plans?’, knowing full well that plenty existed that addressed both manufacturing and the other 4 factors just mentioned. You rejected all of that when you cast your vote for Trump. So the question now becomes ‘what is the Republican plan’ to address these issues. Republicans are the only ones who can set policy right now, which you are fully aware of.

Did you vote for Trump while wringing your hands about the fate of the middle class, yet while also completely ignoring Republicans plans - or lack of plans - for the middle class? Or did you figure that making the middle class pay a new 25% tax on most of their consumables, to finance a tax cut for the wealthiest Americans, would do the trick?

And about those wealthiest Americans getting their tax cut at the cost of $4.5 trillion dollars over the next decade:

As I pointed out in previous posts, we are a point in history were the total earning power of the top 1% is greater that the earning power of the 60%.

Maybe you should think a bit about why that is the case, and how it relates to our struggling middle class.

I am honestly asking you what the alternative plan is. What is the democratic plan? If you don't have one just say there is not.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CAyricurDKg

We know this was the position of most democrats....she was right here, Trump was right then, Bernie was right then. Biden and Harris included tariffs.... I get you don't agree with them, but what is the other plan if we keep NAFTA, the WTO, and China as a favored nation? Do you believe China has our best interests in mind? That they want to help us?

Lol...Trump could cure cancer and you would disagree with him.

Meanwhile, you still have healthcare insurance, transportation, childcare and housing costs to contend with … if you are actually concerned with the viability of our middle class.

I am, and it is failing and getting worse. The plan is that tariffs will be one way to get the middle class in positions to afford these better, how making less and getting poorer fixing that. You said"
Markk, I understand your position. I just don’t agree that tariffs provide the solution that you claim they do" then you want me questions showing you do not understand my position. Then you ask me questions like that when my position is tariffs will help bring back the middle class and take care of those things....again, tell me what the other plan is if we keep free trade open and consume more and export less?

Whether you want to admit it or not, the 1% our key job creators. Can we agree to that? I know you probably hate folks like Musk, Bezos, Gates, and others, but they are the innovators and creators. They need incentives and tax breaks to create more jobs and invest in our economy. It is another thing, again if you believe it or not, that will help bring in more jobs and hopefully better paying jobs.

Because you can't tell me what the plan you support is, so far by deduction it is having more and or larger trade deficits, and tax the hell out of the folks and corporations that create jobs. How will doing that help the middle class? Shall we also grow government jobs, so we can pay them with tax money when in reality seldom add revenue back to the system, but just pay taxes with tax money (house money)? Is that part of your plan to help the middle class.

[canpakes]

I am honestly asking you what the alternative plan is. What is the democratic plan? If you don't have one just say there is not.

Rather, you are simply (1) pretending that you don’t know that Democrats cannot exercise any plan given that they’re the minority party, and (2) pretending that the legislation, programs and/or initiatives put forth by the Biden Administration didn’t exist.

As example:

https://www.americanprogress.org/articl ... al-policy/

https://bidenwhitehouse.archives.gov/br ... n-america/

You’ll keep dodging any examination of tariffs and their effects, and won’t dare acknowledge that they won’t do jack for the real stressors of the Middle Class, because you’re unable to do so.

No worries, Markk - maybe someone else can take this one on. You make a fair cheerleader for Trump talking points generally, but this topic’s a task that you’re not prepared to tackle.

[Markk]

I am honestly asking you what the alternative plan is. What is the democratic plan? If you don't have one just say there is not.

Rather, you are simply (1) pretending that you don’t know that Democrats cannot exercise any plan given that they’re the minority party, and (2) pretending that the legislation, programs and/or initiatives put forth by the Biden Administration didn’t exist.

As example:

https://www.americanprogress.org/articl ... al-policy/

https://bidenwhitehouse.archives.gov/br ... n-america/

I addressed these and you only opined and one, and mistakenly confused the broadband giveaways. Bead and I think Bip of bid or something along that line. The Fact list stated that tariffs were a big part of Bidens plan. And China was bad and implied they did not have our best interests in mind.

I understand that democrats are not in control, but that does not mean they have a plan? Or does it? If there is not a plan, just say so.

I am not pretending that democratic plans did not exist, in fact I am trying to discuss them and how the included tariffs.

I have bee asking for the current democratic caucus plan. The caucus criticizes Trump's plan, so it seems they should at least have a plan they think is better.

You’ll keep dodging any examination of tariffs and their effects, and won’t dare acknowledge that they won’t do jack for the real stressors of the Middle Class, because you’re unable to do so.

Lol where....please lets examine tariffs, we can start with China and the nations I suggested per your request. Vietnam, Cambodia, and a few others. They are doing quite well, with low deficits, on is some case with surplus. Lets examine those by all means. They seem to be building a middle class in some of these nations partly by tariffs.

No worries, Markk - maybe someone else can take this one on. You make a fair cheerleader for Trump talking points generally, but this topic’s a task that you’re not prepared to tackle.

Lol, come on Cakes. I think the real issue is here your only plan here is to oppose Trump. I am the one conceding that the republicans mor than the democrats started the free trade mess. And the Pelosi, Sanders and Trump all got it right when Clinton and Bush were selling out our middle class.

I think you are having a hard time dealing with, or admitting that China does not have our best interests in mind.

If you are bailing out fine, but I will leave you with this, if tariffs do not work, then we are screwed big time if there is not another plan on the table by the Democrat's in that if tariffs do fail they will win the next time around. If you think free trade is the answer, taxing the job makers, retarding innovation, and growing government workers that live real good on the back of the 1% and the 60%, and pay taxes with house money is the answer, we are really screwed.

My asking you what the Democratic answer is, is a very fair question.

[Gadianton]

Some of the highest "reciprocal" tariffs are aimed at Cambodia, Madagascar, Bangladesh. What do our fellow unhinged right-wingers think people making a couple hundred dollars a month are going to buy from the US to make it even? We're going to tariff the crap out of vanilla bean in order to rebuild Detroit?

[Jersey Girl]

Adam Schiff confirms a particular tariff. Penguin related.

Short

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/zOg5_L6pb60

[canpakes]

:: things ::

OK, so still kvetching about Biden, and dodging the issue of what’s really killing off the middle class. No change there.

The kids and I were having some pistachios as a late snack, and had built a nice little pile of shells, and it occurred to me that choosing to ask them questions instead might yield a more productive conversation about tariffs than trying to do so here with you … ‘them’, in this case, being the pile of pistachio shells.
: )

I think you are having a hard time dealing with, or admitting that China does not have our best interests in mind.

There you go again, just pulling things out of thin air. We’ve never discussed China’s ‘best interests’, but if you had merely asked instead of imagining how I’d respond, I’d reply, “of course they don’t”. Neither do we have China’s best interests in mind. Why would either of us?

Anyhow, good luck with your plan to tax the middle class an additional 25% while having no idea where that money is going, let alone how it could find its way back into helping that middle class, or ‘restore manufacturing’. The 1% needs our money more than we do, obviously.

[Jersey Girl]

This is freaking unreal! Completely off the charts NUTS!!

The ridiculous real story behind the tariff plan that turned Donald Trump into a global disaster
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MJbZCbBLqkk